INTERVIEW — TAPE #121, SIDE #1
Q: Mark Russell Bell
CHRISTIAN RESEARCH INSTITUTE BOOK SALE
J: Jimmy Harmanczis (of the CRI)
T: Ted Talupn (acquaintance)
C: Chris Bumpus (acquaintance)
H: Hank Hanegraaff (host of the CRI’s “Bible Answer Man” daily radio broadcast)
P: Paul Young (of the CRI)
S: Scott Larson (of the CRI)
D: Danielle Brosthinsky (of the CRI)
A: Darryl Aarons (of the CRI)
TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: I AM TRANSCRIBING THIS TAPE OUT OF SEQUENCE ON JUNE 10TH WITH MY DICTAPHONE TAPE RECORDER GIVING ME THE BEST AUDIO QUALITY. THIS TAPE WAS RECORDED ON FRIDAY AND SATURDAY, JUNE 7TH AND 8TH. ONE OF THE STATEMENTS I MAKE ON THIS TAPE SIDE CONCERNING FAILURE HAD AN INTERESTING AFTERMATH. LATER THAT EVENING I HEARD A SONG ON THE RADIO WITH LYRICS PROCLAIMING THAT GOD ISN’T A FAILURE AND THE FOLLOWING DAY I BRIEFLY LISTENED TO A RADIO SERMON WITH THIS SAME THEME.)
Q: (speaking into tape recorder) Karel Svoboda is the name of the artist and the year is 1931 written on the back of the canvas of the painting I just purchased today on my way to the gym. I dropped by Amanda Suzanne & Friends and she brought in a rare etching and a rare painting for me to see but I didn’t like it. The oil painting was very old yet it just didn’t ring any bells. (“UH-HUH” “SO”) I had gone next door first — (“UM”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: NEXT DOOR IS FAR CORNERS ANTIQUES & ART. THESE TWO ANTIQUE STORES ARE LOCATED ON NORTH LARCHMONT BOULEVARD ACROSS THE STREET FROM PARAMOUNT PICTURES.)
Q: — so, look, I visited two different stores where the owner had man in their names today. I wasn’t going to go next door but Dae Man Yang was outside with his little doggies and I just felt, “Well, (“HE MUST”) there must be a reason for this.” So I went in and, of course, there was a reason for this because I bought two beautiful small sculptures. I can’t even remember what he told (“THEM”) me about them. I don’t think he really knows much about them. One looks like it’s a little Mexican historical figure. (“RRE” “I GUESS SORT OF”) Sort of Toltec or Olmec — a beautiful green piece. (“CCE”) And I don’t know what the other one is made of — I showed it to Amanda next door and she didn’t know what it was either but it’s (“BEAU”) beautifully polished. And he gave me these two fascinating, original, beautiful pieces for $20 each. He forgot to give me a receipt. I paid cash. Oh, well. Let’s see — the bag he gave me to keep them in says “Total Beauty.” (“YEAH”) “Addy Total Beauty” (“YEAH”) is the bag. I guess it’s a makeshift bag. And I bought the painting for $350 plus $28.50 tax. So another wonderful day. I could have paid a lot more because she wanted $1,500 for the other one and there was another landscape that I kind of liked for $1,250. (“BUT IT JUST”) It just wasn’t quite — and there was another beautiful science fiction-type painting for $5,000. (“WITH A”) “With a signature” — as they say. (“BUT”) I like this one best and it was the least expensive of them all. There’s no accounting for taste. And I think she said it was from Yugoslavia. I also forgot my credit card there so I have to go back next Wednesday. I have a back-up card, not to worry. So the only thing else that’s new is that today in the newspaper and on the radio there’s news that oral sex (“XXX”) may pose a greater risk for HIV transmission than it was otherwise thought. I thought about this when it happened because I’m one of those listeners on the Hotline that always does not downplay the risk of oral sex. I know some of the other listeners sort of dismiss it all the time and I always cringe when I hear this but I don’t say anything because some people think they know everything and they know all the little trivia about HIV but they really blow it on the big issues and, of course, I’m really good when it comes to the big issues. So when this news came out today I felt like, “Oh my goodness, have I been doing things correctly?” and the answer was, “Yes, I have.” And I know there are a few other listeners who, oh my goodness, (“YEAH”) they’re going to start thinking, “How many people have I helped into their illness?” (“YEAH UH-HUH” “SO”) Again, I’m one of these people that knows the magnitude of every single interaction that we have in life. It makes life a lot more interesting but it (“ALL”) sort of keeps you on your toes. (“SO IS YOUR” “I MEAN IT’S”) Life is much more interesting now that I know Mighael’s here. I always want to be the best person I can be for myself and for Mighael. So (“OOO”) I’m going to (“TAKE”) go by the pool now for a little while. (“IT’S”) Because it’s the weekend and it’s hot. (“BUT FIRST”) And then when I come back I’ll say my little prayer or maybe I’ll say it when I’m in the pool. Oh well.
( . . . )
Q: So I forgot to say that Lovey-Boo did something very sweet yesterday at the party. (“YYY” “I”) It was dinnertime and Baba couldn’t come at the last moment so we were all kind of helping out organizing the dinner even though Charlotte did most of the work. (“KKK”) So I was kind of trying to help out where I could. Even though they didn’t think the rice was hot enough so they were going to microwave it and I said, “No,” because then all the nutrients will go out. So they left a portion of it for me and it tasted fine. It didn’t really need to be microwaved. (“BUT”) That was my own opinion and I ate from the non-microwaved rice. I can’t believe the things people argue about. (“SO”) Anyway, when I finally got my dinner and went to sit down, I realized I forgot to get one of the plastic forks. And where I had been sitting before there was a little plastic fork (“KKK”) on my dish of hors d’oeuvres. (“SSS”) I thought that was very sweet. And you can see why I’m so happily living here with Mighael. And tonight when I was eating dinner, “Because You Loved Me” performed by Celine Dion came on the radio followed by “Circle of Life” performed by Elton John. (“I MEAN JUST” “Y[OU]”) You know, it’s nice to hear loving songs from your dearest. (“AND I”) I forget sometimes (“THAT”) people like the romantic parts best. (“TTT”) I know I certainly do.
( . . . )
Q: So I didn’t get lost. I actually made it to the Christian Research Institute for their book sale. I’m just wearing a T-shirt, jeans and my “Messiah” cap. So I’m trying to find out information on successful ministries.
( . . . )
(“J”)
Q: I was wondering — I’m not that familiar with (“L” “C”) Christian Research Institute. What are they doing to help other humanity across the world?
J: That’s a good question. (“UH-HUH”) We basically are sort of an apologetics organization. (“NOTHING”)
Q: A what?
J: Apologetics.
Q: What does that mean?
J: Like we explain the truth of the Bible versus heretical teachings of other religions of the same — (“OH I SEE — OKAY” “BEAUTIFUL”) in other words, if somebody’s on the wrong path to God (“UH-HUH”) why, he’s condemned.
Q: Are we talking worship?
J: We’re talking saving. (“UH-HUH”)
Q: No, but I mean like helping in terms of (“HELP ME”) helping poverty and (“SHUH”) things like that. (“THANK YOU” “O HH”)
J: That’s — (“SIT HERE”) I think we go beyond (“HEY”) helping with poverty because (“RA”) people in poverty (“CAN’T HELP”) are in poverty because of God. I mean they don’t know God. (“IF HE WALKED IN”) That’s why they’re in poverty. (“BUT” “LEN”) You know what I’m trying to say? (“HEE-HAW”) Like (“COME BACK” “WHAT AM I”) we live and then we die and — well, the question is where do we go after we die? (“HEAR THAT POINT”)
Q: Right, so, see, but I think that God —
J: But if you —
Q: — wants people to help other people.
J: That’s right. But first you have to know Him and, well, see what He wants (“YEAH”) to do. (“OTHER PEOPLE”)
Q: I think there’s been too much worshiping and repetition (“YAHWEH”) of mindless prayer. (“NO”)
J: Well, that’s — oh, you’re talking about tradition. I’m talking about — see, Christianity’s not a religion. (“WELL THAT” “UNCLE” “YOU’RE MY SKIN”) It’s a relationship with God, you know? (“W” “THE STING”)
Q: Right. (“LISTEN”)
J: And knowing God. (“NO”) And knowing what He wants us to do in life. (“UM-HUH”)
Q: What’s your last name, (“KNOW THAT” “U”) by the way? (“COCTEAU”)
J: Harmanczis. (“GAY” “BILL”)
Q: Where are you from?
J: Greece. (“HOME”)
Q: What is that last name? (“YOUR PROBLEM”) Spell that. I’m not good at Greek names.
J: Okay. (“I DO”) It’s a long name. (“KEVIN” “BLACK”)
J: H — A — R — M — A — N — (“KNEE”) C — Z — I — S.
Q: M — A — N? As in Son of Man? (“MONEY ON” “W”)
J: (small laugh) (“STOP”)
Q: Get it?
J: Son of Man. Yes. (“TROLL” “N”)
Q: Oh, okay. Well, that’s good. (“CORPSE”) I mean I — (“I WAS”)
J: So the thing is — (“I MIGHT LOVE YOU” “TAKE IT”)
Q: Who is this guy over here (“YOU’RE GAY”) that all these people (“BETTER”) are waiting in line (“OF THE”) to see?
J: That’s the president of the company.
Q: What’s his name? (“NOW HURRY”)
J: Hank Hanegraaff. (“HENDRIK” “OF THE COMPANY”) The guy here?
Q: Is he good? Is he a nice guy? (“OSLO” “YEAH”)
J: Yeah, he answers all the questions on the show. (“BROKEN ARM”) Listen to him? (“OH I’M” “MAYBE THIS” “COAST” “YEAH”)
Q: Those shows are so funny — (“BECAUSE OF THE” “WHERE’S THE” “I”) the callers are such (“THE”) wackos. (“BEDTIME” “YEAH” “HURRY”)
J: Oh, you listen to it? (“GRIN”) Because the largest — (“OUT OF STEAM” “MY FATHER”)
Q: I heard it — (“LAST WEEK” “PULLED A”) I heard last week and this guy was going to kill himself (“A BOMB” “LIT” “YEAH”) unless this guy talked to him. (“COMMON” )
J: Yeah, but see what I’m saying? (“MONDAY” “WALK”) Also he has —
Q: I listen (“LISTEN TO”) to him on the way home from the gym unless I’m late — (“LIKE TAKE A”)
J: Yeah.
Q: — then I listen to the guy who comes on after him — (“DEBORAH” “YOU’RE SO” “GOOD”) Chuck Missler.
J: But basically we just sort truth from error and we help people discern it for themselves. (“THAT’S RIGHT” “HEARD YOU’RE JEWISH”)
Q: I’m not going to ask him what I asked you (“SMART”) because he’ll just give me a hard time. (“OHH”) I’m going to ask him a more theoretical question. (“COCHRAN”) He’s more comfortable with that. (“YEAH”)
J: You can ask him any question you want. (“OKAY” “AS HE” “YALL HIS OVER” “POEM”)
Q: Is there a time limit? (“UH-HUH” “CARLY”)
J: Well, I don’t know. People will give you a time limit. (“THE FAMILY” “KNEW” “DAVID”)
Q: I better get in line. Right? (“YEAH”) But, wait, what’s the best (“TELL US”) books to get?
J: Well, it depends (“HOW”) on what you want.
Q: Okay. (“BOND”) Do you have any books that are (“SEE”) funny like God and Jesus — (“COME ON”) like maybe Jesus (“GA”) was mad at God or something? (“ARE YOU INSANE”)
J: No, see because that’s not — to us (“PAY”) Christians — not funny.
Q: No, but funny. Funny. I like funny things. (“LIKE WHAT IT DOES”)
J: See, (“THE THROW”) you may think that now — (“I NEED HELP” “VITAMIN”) like you say that’s how people (“ARE” “ALI”) that publish all that stuff —
Q: Um-huh. (“UH-HUH”)
J: — but that’s really not what people (“PEOPLE”) need. (“ONLY A DOCTOR” “CALL KYM” “A REAL”) First you need God. (“YEAH”) Then you can help them see — but if you — let me give you an example. (“WITH THE”) If you (“CALL ME”) got to, (“THE MOST”) let’s say, a religious person — (“NO WAY AT ALL”) right? And just go out helping people — (“OH NO HE HASN’T SEEN HIM YET”) right? And you don’t believe in God? (“HMM” “RIGHT NOW”) Then it’s all for nothing.
Q: But I just think (“US”) God would rather have people (“NO” “OH YEAH”) helping other people — (“PRETTY GOOD” “LOVE ME”)
J: Let me explain.
Q: — than worshiping Him. (“WITHIN US” “POETRY”)
J: If you don’t know God, right, and you die? (“THE STRUGGLE”) You go straight to hell, right? (“OR LINGER” “GOD”)
Q: Not necessarily. (“THE” “DON’T BE GLIB” “NUT”)
J: Now God says so. (“SUPPOSE” “SO” “EVIDENCE”) Unless you think God is —
Q: You mean Jesus said so. (“GOOD POINT” “VASECTOMY” “LOOK OUT”) Because Jesus invented hell.
J: And God in the Bible — no. (“ONE” “FF”) If you look at — (“MY SON”) read the Bible —
Q: Well, I’m writing a book —
J: — the Bible says —
Q: — and I want you to read it when it comes out. (“THAT’S WRITTEN”)
J: — that (“FOR” “WHO’S THAT”) hell is created for the Devil (“NICE”) and his angels. God gave man free choice. (“IS NOW” “OKAY”)
Q: Yeah, but these were metaphors.
J: No, not metaphors.
Q: Well, I’m going to (“TALK”) get in line to speak to him. (“THE MOVIE”) If you want to come talk to me while I’m in line, fine.
J: That’s okay.
Q: Okay.
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: I INTERVIEWED SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN THE LINE.)
Q: What did she say (“MY”) about evolution versus (“GAY”) creationism? (“MIGHAEL” “THEY COME”)
T: I wasn’t paying attention. (“I KNOW BUT SHE” “YEAH”)
Q: Oh. (“HOW TRUE”) What do you think? (“GOD” “ANDY” “ONE” “UNDER TYRANNY”)
T: I don’t know.
Q: I think that God invented (“TIME TO GO HOME” “ONLY TWO”) evolution. (small laugh) (“ONLY BY” “UH-HUH”) That’s the easy way, I think, (“LAWYER”) of explaining it. (ROAR “THE JURY” “YOU KNOW” “NOT SO GOOD”)
T: Good, huh? (“I’VE SEEN IT” “TALL”)
Q: Oh my goodness. Wait, what’s your name? (“HARVEY” “THIR” “TEEN”)
T: Ted. (“CARRY OFF”)
Q: Are you from here? L.A.? (“COLON”)
T: I was. (“LOVE TO YOU”) I moved out of here. (“I” “YOU HATE”)
Q: Oh really? (“HEART”) Where did you go?
T: San Diego. (“WHAT” “UM-HUH”)
Q: How is it? It’s not as crowded. (“SKULL” “Y. S. Q.” “WOOD”)
T: Yeah. (“WE”) Its nicer too. (“OH” “KISS MY” “GRITS”) Different. (“HOME”) And warmer too. (“UM-HUH” “MMMMMMM MMMMMMM”)
Q: And what’s your ancestry? (“A NUMEROUS”)
T: Filipino. (“SON” “FILIPINO” “I HAVEN’T GOTTEN OVER PAIN . . .” “UM-HUH”)
Q: What’s (“WHAT”) your last name? (“THEN I” “THEY’RE INCREASING”)
T: Talupn. (“KNEE” “O” “WE’RE THE”)
Q: Spell that. (“I JUST FLEW THE” “NOTHING”)
T: T — A — (“L U”) L — U — P — N. (“MADE”)
Q: And what does that mean? (“PROFITABLE” “I” “I HAVE”)
T: I have no idea. (“SAVE ONE FOR ME” “MY HO”) That’s just a name. (“WHEN” “Y” “COLD FEET” “PREGNANT” “JEW” “MAYAN” “DISCO”)
Q: Um-huh. (“UR” “THEY’D LIKE A BIT” “YOU” “BUT THEY BUY” “CREDENZA”) My name’s Russell (“TWO MORE”) and I always forget the original name it comes from too. (“DON’T LOOK NOW” “NEW TRICK”) My mother’s maiden name was King. (“WHO IN THE HELL WAS THAT” “YOUR TONGUE” “HERE”) That’s an easy one. (“I’VE HEARD IT TOO” “CYNIC” “COMPLETELY” “CUTS” “THE FAN MAIL” “I REMEMBER” “BUT” “WHEN” “FOR YOU”) Russell is (“RIGHT”) something — (“DU”) I keep saying ‘du Rose’ but it’s not. It’s something else. (“LEAVE YOUR LIGHTS ON” “UHH” “WE TAKE THEM” “NO COMMENT”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: LE ROZEL IS THE NAME THAT BECAME RUSSELL.)
Q: Look at that T-shirt that says “His pain your gain.” (“LOVE YOU”) Ohh, it’s gross. Blood. (“BE NO PAIN” “DADDY” “YOU’RE”) I’m very squeamish. (“OF THAT” “YOU’RE VERY” “I LOVE YOU”)( . . . )
Q: Excuse me, have you been (“NO” “HERE”) to one of these sales before? (“DEFINITELY NO” “YOU HEAR THAT” “AM I IN HELL” “YOU USE UP” “THINK ABOUT” “I’LL HOLD IT” “IHH” “UHH” “AM FINE”)
(CUE)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE PERSON I TRIED TO INTERVIEW HADN’T HEARD ME AND WALKED ON.)
(“DOES IT”)
Q: That’s nice. Somebody’s got to do it.
C: Um-huh. (“THE”)
Q: What church do you go to? (“OH”)
C: Calvary Chapel, Chino Valley. (“I GUESS” “I MISS” “CHINO VALLEY” “HOW ARE YOU”)
Q: Well, I’m not familiar with that —
C: David Rosales. (“TO US” “IT HURTS” “YEAH” “WE’LL NEVER GET OVER IT”)
Q: What denomination is that? (“HOLY” “GROWING”) Non-denomination? (“AL” “I WANT TO PRESS CHARGES”)
C: Yeah. Christians. (“YEAH”) Jesus Christ. (“ACQUITTAL”)
Q: Yeah. (“WILL BE”)
C: (laughs) (“AT HOME” “WHAT DID I”)
Q: Exactly.
C: That’s it. (“THE” “YEAH” “OKAY” “THAT FAR DOWN” “FOR A LITTLE” “OH BOY”)
Q: I go to the Philosophical (“YEAH”) Research (“THROW ME A BOOK” “I WONDER”) Society (“WITH A GUN”) in L.A. It’s (“IT DOESN’T MATTER”) wonderful. (“RECORDED” “CAN’T WAIT” “SSS” “IMPORTANT”) They have somebody (“SOLD A”) different (“RIGHT”) speak every week. (“YEAH” “FINANCIAL” “SO WHY”) So it’s (“COME AGAIN” “WATER”) always interesting. (“FOREIGN” “TEST”) It’s only an hour so (“I’LL DREAM” “I’M WORRIED” “BELL” “WHOA”) you still have the whole day (“OUTCOME”) ahead. (“BOND” “TO CONCLUDE” “I’M HERE TO FIND OUT WHEN” (“ABOUT LOVE” “YEAH” “THE” “I LISTEN” “HERE” “POET” “GREAT” “FRONT OF YOU” “THAT’S THE WAY I SEEM” “CODA”) By the way, what’s your name? (“BILL” “MINDY” “DEAD”)
C: Chris. (“I HEAR” “WILL BE” “I DON’T WANT”)
Q: As in Christ. (“YOU’RE RIGHT” “I DID NOT”)
C: (small laugh) (“SLOW DOWN”) No, (“SO”) but — (small laugh) (“YOU LIE”)
Q: What’s your last name? (“GO AHEAD”)
C: Bumpus. (“MELON” “DEGREES”)
Q: B — U — M — P — U — S? (“L A”)
C: Yeah. (“PASSING” “GOOD DAY”)
Q: Bump us (“BIG S”) in the night.
C: Like to ‘bump us.’ (“DIVORCE”)
Q: Things that go bump us.
C: That’s right. (small laugh) (“IN THE NIGHT” “BAD” “MOOD” “I LOVE YOU” “FUN” “SAY” “UUUUHHH” “VULGAR”)
Q: Ohhh. (“LIZZIE” “GARCIA” “WOWNER” “PADRE” “DAY” “I’M GAY” “NOW TICKLE ME” “HE DOES THAT” “GOD’S IN A LOT OF TROUBLE” “SHAMPOO” “YEAH” “HIS OWN”)
C: She’s got the book they gave us free (“A BIG HURRY”) for buying the tapes. (“BONE” “LUCKY” “VITAMIN”)
Q: What is it?
C: I mean — I’m sorry — (“THAT”) The Christian Research Journal. (“WANT “ENJOY” “ME”)
Q: What is that? Is that one I’d be interested in? (“RUSS” “RING” “OUT” “CITY”) I can’t read it even. (“UTMO[ST]”) My —
C: Utmost for His Highest (by Oswald Chambers).
Q: — Utmost for His Highest. I’m trying to think of a really tough question (“DOOR”) to ask him. (“HONEY”)
C: I don’t know. (“I FOUND” “WELL HE”) I’ve only seen one guy stump him.(“RIGID”)
Q: Really? What was the question? (“MAY”)
C: I don’t even remember. (“UH” “OH” “MET AT A” “BABY”) But I’ll find out for you. (“WE’RE THE COACH” “OKAY” “WELL IT’S NO[T]” “I WOU[LD]”)
Q: I like — (“TO ASK”)
C: He’s an — (“HE’S” “DON’T LIE”)
Q: — to ask theoretical questions.
C: — extremely (“WAS” “WAS”) straightforward (“BUT” “THINK REASONABLY”) and if he don’t know he’ll say, (“WHY”) “You know what? I don’t know. (“IF I”) I’ll find out.” But (“CAN’T AGREE” “THROUGH THEIR”) he knew how (“LET THEM GO” “THERE IS A WAY” “USING”)
Q: He’s usually right.
C: — I’ve only had one guy. (“DAMN IT” “NO” “I MEAN” “IT CA[N]” “FOR HIM”)
Q: The Bible is so (“BUT”) confusing and so complicated. (“IF THEY””ONE OF A” “WHY”)
C: He’s so good at it, though. He has — (“YOU’RE OWN” “GOOD” “LAW” “LIKE”) I think it’s Proverbs that (“WHAT A WORLD”) he has totally (“GOOD MORNING” “HAUNT”) memorized. (“THE TWO” “GOLDEN”)
Q: Oh my God. (“WE CARE” “DOUBLE” “I THINK HEN” “PROVERBS” “THE” “A E” “TOYS IN OUR”) I don’t remember my Social Security number. (“MAY I” “LOVER” “BOY” “UM-HUH”)
C: Me neither. I carry — (small laugh) (“PAID”/”I” “FUN”/”I” “ORDER”/”I”) I think that’s what it is. (“YEAH”/”I” “PUT HIM IN”) So I think the Proverbs. (“I DON’T DOUBT IT” “RIGHT” “MAY WE” “GONNA SOCK” “WHEN” “ONE TOE”) Every year I think he says (“TODAY I WAS” “YEAH”) he tries to memorize (“DEFEND”) one book. (“MOTHER A” “PRAY” “MY MOM”) That’s his goal, (“EIEUUUU”) I think. (“WHERE’S MY” “I” “I HAVE” “TREATMENT” “WHAT” “THE GOAL”)
Q: What if God came out (“OR HE”) with a new bible? (“HE’S NOT THERE” “HATE”) He’d have to start all over. (“NEW BIBLE”)
C: Well, (“A NEW”) we know that’s not going to happen. (“I KNOW HIM” “SO”)
Q: No, we don’t. (“UHH”) We don’t know anything. (“HER SUCKIN” “DON’T KNOW” “YOU’RE THE THING” “YEAH” “ROLE” “A DODO” “A CAP”)( . . . ) (“DO THEY COME IN HERE”)
Q: There are so many flies buzzing around (“AROUND”) here. (“GOING TO TALK TOO” “YEAH” “TICK”) Such a pain. (“IN HERE” “GET TO WEAR IN [PHONETIC] MARNEBURG” “ALL I KNOW” “REPORT”)
( . . . )
(“WE’RE THE” “I CAN” “HERE I COME”)
Q: Hi, Hank. It’s so nice to meet you. (“THEY ALL”)
H: Nice to meet you.
Q: I feel as if I know you. (“HURRAH”) I always listen to you on the way home from the gym.
H: Oh, great.
Q: And you deal with so many difficult cases. I really have lots of sympathy with you. So, anyway, I was thinking of a good question while I was in line. And the lady behind me helped me come up with — and I would never put you on the spot (“UH-HUH”) on the radio broadcast. (“THIS IS”) This question is really too hard. (“OH THAT’S LIKE” “MINE”) But what if God were to say, “Okay, (“THEY’LL LOVE YOU”) here’s a new Bible (“THANKS SO MUCH”) and the old one is no longer valid. (“THEY’LL”) But here’s a new one for you and I want you to spread its word.” What would you do?
H: Well, first of all, — (“THE”)
Q: And He’d have proof. Like He’d give His new Jesus or whatever, like, the Ark of the (“LET”) Covenant or something.
H: Okay, here’s the problem with the question. The problem with the question is (“SAY THE”) you’re asking me, (“THE” “UH OH”) “What if (“WHY”) a triangle (“BECOME”) suddenly became (“I”) a circle?”
Q: Right.
H: What would you call it?
Q: Um-huh. That’s what I’m doing.
H: Yeah.
Q: Yeah.
H: You see — (“THE — HE”)
Q: No, but I’m not saying — (“I MEAN YOU CAN DO”) not to base this on — this is just from your heart you can answer this. (“YEAH”)
H: No, I am answering it. (“AA”)
Q: Oh, okay.
H: By using that as an example. (“BUT IT”) But a triangle by definition is a triangle — can never become a circle. (“A DOLLAR” “YOU HA[VE]” “YOU”)
Q: Does that mean (“RIGHT” “YOUR”) your mind is totally closed to any possibility? (“LIKE” “WHO THE HELL”)
H: No. (“THAT’S RIGHT” “WHA[T]”) What I’m saying — (“IGNORE” “DD” “STAY THERE” “CRY” “NO” “SOLEMN”) follow the reasoning.
Q: Okay. (“DEMAND” “THE”)
H: If in fact (“BROUGHT” “DAY”) you have a triangle, (“THIS”) it can never become a circle — (“UH-HUH”) right?
Q: Well, you have the Father, son and the Holy Ghost.
H: No no no no, I’m not talking about that.
Q: Oh, okay. (“I”)
H: I’m just talking about geometry figures right now.
Q: Right.
H: Okay? (“TOO VIOLENT”) A triangle can never become a circle. (“AA”)
Q: Okay.
H: Right? (“[O]KAY WELL I MEAN”)
Q: Okay, this is a waste of time to ask that question.
H: No, it’s not a waste of time. (“OKAY” “WE’RE ALL” “IT’S A” “POOH”) A triangle can’t change — (“THE” “IN”)
Q: But what if God — (“CIRCLE”) God can do anything. (“FOR ME”)
H: But, no, God cannot change His nature. (“THAT’S”) Nature does not change.
Q: He’s love.
H: But His nature never changes. (“AA” “MY” “THAT’S OKAY” “THEY’RE TRUE”)
Q: Right.
H: God’s nature — (“DO MY”) in other words, (“COP OUT”) it’s like asking can God (“A TO Z” “THEY BELONG” “YOU’RE A BAD”) even make a stone so big He can’t carry it. It’s a confusion of categories. (“SUPERMAN” “NUMBER ONE”)
Q: I thought it was very clear. (“HHH” “GAM” “BY THE WAY WHAT”) The only thing, see — (“UH HH”) recently I’ve been sort of losing respect for Jesus — I know that sounds terrible but (“WE”) because I look around and I see (“YEAH”) no one really following his word. They just sort of pay him lip service and they don’t really help their fellow (“WWW”) man. (“GIVE A”) So he’s sort of an underachiever. (“OR A”) He’s sort of a failure. (“AND I”) I’m having difficulty with that. (“WHAT” “OU” “WWW”)
H: How does that — (“AA” “ME”) why would you have difficulty with that?
Q: Because everything that Jesus taught no one’s doing so He must not have been (“YEAH”) a very good teacher. (“NEW ONE” “LOOK AT THE” “BUT I MEAN” “THEY DO”)
H: That does not (“THEY DO”) reflect on His teachings (“IN THE”) at all. (“TAUGHT”) I mean what you need to do (“ASPIRIN”) is evaluate His teachings — (“THEY” “YEAH”) based on His teachings. (“TEST ME”)
Q: Yeah. (“CALL ME”) But I think we’re all sort of, you know, the sons of God (“DDD”) so (POWER”) I can respect him for his (“TRADE”) valiant effort. (“MEANING”) I mean it’s probably too much for any one person to fulfill. (“DO WE”)
H: He was God. It’s not too much for God to do. (“SON”)
Q: Well, we’re all God. (“THE THREE” “YOU HATE HIM”)
H: Well, you may think (“DDHARTHA”) you’re God —
Q: No, we’re all — you know, God is in all of us. (“US” “OH DEAR”)
H: Well — (“OKAY”) that’s a different proposition than saying that we’re all God.
Q: But I think Jesus would have said that.
H: Well, that’s one thing to think. (“HIGHER” “MY CA[P]”)
Q: I mean he had —
H: So it’s not true.
Q: — you know — (“I MEAN HE”)
H: It’s not what He said. (“COME HERE”)
Q: He’s like all of us. I mean he had bad teeth. (“SO”) And bad skin (“CLEAR”) probably. (“HAPPEN” “MY” “AN[D]”)
Q: Bad — probably — B. O. (“BUT UM” “BUT IN THE BIBLE”) What if He said, “Okay, Jesus is a metaphor and here’s a new Jesus.” (“IN ME”) And (“NO”) here’s a new Bible. (“YES”)
H: Well, God can’t go against (“OH GET REAL”) His nature. (“I FEEL” “BUT”)
Q: But what if He wasn’t? What if He was just revealing (“YOU”) that some of his (“DOUBLE”) dogma was metaphor? (“HE KNOWS” “I”)
H: Well, what if you were (“I WAS”) an ant? (“HELP”) You’re not. (“SORRY”)
Q: Well, — (“THAT’S”)
H: I mean —
Q: — yeah. No, I’m just posing an (“EDEN” “OTHER WORDS” “COUNTRY”) interesting question.
H: In other words, you can stand here and say that you’re a gopher or an ant.
Q: But what if — (“OKAY”)
H: That doesn’t make you a gopher or an ant.
Q: — this new Jesus had the Ark of the (“OF THE”) Covenant and (“I”) said, “Okay, look, I own the Ark of the (“OF THE”) Covenant — (“OH YEAH”) God gave me (“OKAY”) the Ark of the Covenant (“MIGHAEL”) as proof (“THAT” “I”) that I am Son of Man” (“GO[D]”) or something? (“OR A” “HOW”)
H: But my point is — (“WE KNOW”) and that’s why I tried (“GO”) to start out by trying to have your mind click in to the logical fallacy of saying that a triangle can never become a circle. (“PARADIGM”) It can’t because if a triangle (“OH I GOT IT” ) were a circle you wouldn’t call it a triangle you’d call it a (“AA”) circle. The same thing with God’s nature — (“IN HELL”) you cannot take God’s (“AA”) nature —
Q: Um-huh.
H: — and change God’s nature (“YOU’RE READY”) or you can’t (“UM-HUH”) take your (“HAIL THE”) nature and (“I”) change it and be logically consistent. So if I start talking to you as though you’re an ant —
Q: Well, I’m more emotional than logical. (“LLL” “STAY”)
H: Huh?
Q: I admit that I’m much more of a loving — (“KILL” “LIE”) I mean (“AAL”) emotional person. Logic and science are just (“LOOK AT”) too much for me to (“WORRY”) worry about. (“BE SURE”)
H: Well, but —
Q: But I do think God is love.
H: — you can’t consistently live in this world if you were not logical to some degree.
Q: Oh, well (“I MEAN”) I’m very logical.
H: Yeah. (“SAY”) Oh, you just said (“BUT”) you weren’t.
Q: No, but I know (“YOU’RE” “I MEAN”) the emphasis is (“PUT”) on my emotions and what I feel in my heart. (“I”) And I feel in my heart that if Jesus were to somehow (“I”) come back today he’d tell everyone to stop (“DO IT”) worrying about dogma and ministry and really (“JUST” “DO”) put all their efforts into helping other people. (“BUT”)
H: But then why —
Q: That’s much more loving.
H: — did Jesus not (“YEAH”) say that? (“WRONG”)
Q: But who knows what he said? (“WELL WE”) We just have this book that’s gone through twenty different (“RIGHT”) variations over the years. (“UH NO”)
H: Well, that’s — (“I” “SELL” “WELL” “RIGHT”) what you’re saying’s simply not true.
Q: No, but I mean there were the — (“HOW”)
H: See, he’s making stuff up. (“NO”)
Q: No, I’m not.
H: Yes, you are.
Q: I’m just saying —
H: You said it went through twenty different revisions?
Q: Yeah. (“HE’S RIGHT”)
H: So where did you come up with that? (“MINE”)
Q: There’s a book I read. (“IT”)
H: How do you know it’s true?
Q: Manly Hall wrote this book about the evolution of the Bible.
H: How do you know it’s true? (“WET” “BE MY” “CAUSE IT”)
Q: I don’t have the book with me.
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE BIBLE: THE STORY OF A BOOK BY MANLY P. HALL IS PUBLISHED BY THE PHILOSOPHICAL RESEARCH SOCIETY, INC.)
(“BUT”)
H: But how do you know it’s true? (“EIGHTY-THREE”)
Q: Okay, King James, for example, who was a (“OCCU”) dabbler in the occult, was the one who (“TOOK IT ALL”) was responsible for the King James version. (“THIS”)
H: So what? (“THE”)
Q: Well, see, — (“PLAY” “SEE WHAT A”)
H: The question is that is it — (“BLAME” “FAMILY TALK” “I”) I don’t care if he was Attila the Hun.
Q: Right.
H: Did the work that he had commissioned (“I TOLD YOU”) in 1604 — (“OKAY”) was that done precisely or was it not done precisely? That’s the question. (“AND SO”)
Q: Nothing’s perfect. (“I” “WE[LL]” “TO SAY” “POINT”)
H: The way you check that (“CAMERA”) out (“AROUND” “ME”) is you go back (“NO”) to the manuscript evidence and you test (“OF THE” “BELL”) the work of James the First by the manuscript evidence. (“RIGHT”)
Q: Right. What is that?
H: Okay? Well, you look at the manuscript evidence. You look at archaeological evidence. (“CYCLE”) You see (“ADA”) if, in fact, the manuscripts themselves that we have (“LABOR”) are consistent with the interpretation and the translation. (“OKAY”)
Q: Are there any books on that?
H: Sure. There are lots of them. In fact, there’s a good (“UH-HUH”) book (“RIGHT”) that we have right here —
Q: Okay.
H: — on the King James version. (“WHO” “NO”) You should read it. (“GOYA”)
Q: Okay, my horoscope said to tell whoever I spoke to today — (“OH”)
H: You shouldn’t be listening to horoscopes.
Q: — to (“SEE THE”) put up or shut up. (“A” “HE DID”) You know, so I guess I’ll have to check out that book. What’s the title again? (“HARASS” “UM”)
H: What — what’s the — (“WANT” “ROMEO”) James White’s book?
P: The King James Only Controversy.
H: Yeah. King James Only. (“WET” “SO WE HAVE A” “I” “YOU”)
Q: Will you get that for me?
P: I’ll take you over and show you where it is.
Q: Okay, fine. Okay. (“THE”)
P: I’ll take you over there.
Q: And, let’s see, what else was I going to ask you? Oh, I also (“I HAVE THIS” “A”) wanted to give you this. These are some polaroids — and I know I was bad — I know you think it’s bad but I went to a channeler and tried to speak to God. (“THE”)
H: Okay, why don’t you (“YOU”) give it to him?
Q: Okay fine. (“OKAY”) It’s very interesting. (“I DON’T THINK LIKE”)
P: Let’s go over and look for that book.
Q: Okay. (“OKAY”)
P: Okay.
Q: Nice meeting you. (“SOME” “THAT’S ME”) Oh, you didn’t autograph my book.
H: Sure. Be happy too.
Q: I’m so in agreement that Christianity is in crisis. God has to do something. He has to. There’s so much pain and suffering in the world. (“I”) It just breaks my heart. (“THANK YOU” “OKAY” “FOR US” “SORRY”)
H: Well, you can be part of the solution. (“THANK YOU”)
Q: Oh, I plan to be. (“PAINT BRUSH”) Thank you.
H: You’re welcome.
P: Let’s go and look for the —
Q: Okay. (“BOOK” “WHOA” “THAT HURT” “FIND” “I” “I”) What’s your name? Paul?
P: Young. (“I MEAN”)
Q: Young?
P: Right. (“QUIET” “HE’S THE MANAGER”) Thanks for coming to see us. (“TODAY”)
Q: You know — I’m trying to think. (“I HAVE ONE” “YEAH”) I might have — (“I’M A”) We might be cousins (“CLOSE”) because (“I BECAME” “THE”) there’s a Young in my family tree.
P: Really? (“CHECK”)
Q: I think so. (“BOOK”) Unless I’m getting confused.
P: Yeah? (“YOU ARE A”) Okay. (“BUY” “ELLEN” “SKY” “LOOK AT MY” “PROBLEM”) Do we have The King James Only Controversy? (“WRECK” “HURRY”) The James White book? (“ADD UP” “HOME”)
S: I believe so. (“NOW BUY” “A STORY”)
P: I think there is.
S: Over here. (“RIGHT” “BELL”) Let me go look.
P: Hank was suggesting White.
Q: Okay, great. (“DICK”) Thank you.
S: Yes.
Q: Okay. Thank you, Paul. (“BENNY PUBLISH” “THE”)
P: Okay, great. (“UHHHHHH”)
Q: And where do I pay for these?
P: It’s right back over here.
Q: Okay. (“WOOD”)
S: We’ll get the book and then (“BUY”) you’ll be able to take it up front.
Q: Okay, fine, (“READY”) Scott.
S: The King James Controversy — $7. (“I DO” “POPPINS”) If it’s not here, I’ll run up and —
Q: Okay. (“FOR YOU”)
S: — in the bookstore. Here it is.
Q: Oh, good. Oh, thank you. (“BE GOOD” “YOU’RE” “LIVING”)
S: That’ll help you out. (“HELL” “DYING”)
Q: White. James R. White.
S: James White. (“RIGHT” “PERRIER”)
Q: Who’s he?
S: Now there was some — (“EVERYDAY”) he was interviewed on the broadcast as well. I don’t know if you side with this school (“BROWN”) but he lives in Arizona. (“NO” “DIE” “UH-HUH”) But Hank interviewed him on “The Bible Answer Man” as well. (“HA[NK] HA[NK] HA[NK]” “CALL THE” “HA HA HA” “I” “QUITE A BIG”) And there are (“I”) some cassettes of him being interviewed. (“GOT HER THE RING”)
Q: Oh, it looks like Hank’s real name is Hendrik. (“THEY WATCH”) Where’s that (“DRUG” “WHAT”) from? (“IS HE”)
S: Dutch.
Q: Dutch. (“NO” “A AA”)
S: He’s Dutch. (“IRELAND”) Yeah. (“SAW”)
Q: I’m writing a book that (“BE”) looks at ancestry and what-have-you so that’s why I’m always asking people (“FOR”) their names.
S: Alright. Yeah. (“I”)
Q: Scott, what’s your last name? (“EVERY”)
S: Larson. (“PUT A” “OKAY”)
Q: L — A — R — S — O — (“O”) N?
S: S — O. Yeah. (“EVERY”)
Q: Son of Man. Another Son of Man name. (“WHAT” “GALLERY”)
S: Okay, it is. (“OH” “GUESS” “DREAM”)
Q: Uh-huh. (“SLOW” “ONE MORE”)
S: Okay.
Q: Lucky you.
S: Yeah.
Q: What are you reading? (“OH I”)
S: Actually, I’m needing to bring this back — (“DON’T DO IT RIGHT”) a print to the bookstore. (“PAPERBACK”)
Q: Oh, okay. (“ONE” “SO”) You’re not reading Islam.
S: No.
Q: You’re a Christian.
S: No. (“YEAH” “FAMOUS” “FACE” “OKAY”)
Q: Okay, thank you.
S: At least today.
Q: Okay. (“YOUNG” “TAKE IT”) Do you also have any funny comedic books? (“I CAN’T” “LIKE” “DO YOU”) Like jokes between Jesus and God or anything funny?
S: No. (“NO”) Nothing. (“SON”)
Q: Okay.
S: Just strictly (“NO” “YEAH”) Bible teaching. (“I” “BURNING”)
Q: Okay, thank you. (“YOU’RE IT”)
S: Thank you. (“FOR GOD”)
Q: I’ll look around.
( . . . )
(“NOTHING BUY HER” “STRAW” “MAD”)
Q: Hi, Danielle. (“THE BLOOD” “BY THE”) By the way, it says (“SAYS”) “Have you subscribed to the Journal?” Are they free subscriptions or —
D: No, they’re not. (“WE’RE MAKING”) They’re $20 for one year, $37 for — (“TOO HIGH AMOUNT”)
Q: Okay, I’ll pass. (“OKAY”)
D: Okay.
Q: I have a very (“NEW”) limited attention span. (“O-OH” “DO YOU” “OKAY”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: COMMENTS FROM PEOPLE AT THE PURCHASING COUNTER ARE DESIGNATED ‘P’ WHILE UNIDENTIFIED EMPLOYEES ARE DESIGNATED ‘E.’)
P: We’re getting one of these free.
D: Oh, cool. Yeah. (“UM-HUH”)
Q: (sighs)
D: Okay. Thank you. (“HEAVEN”)
Q: Hank was very nice. (“NO” “US” “L S” “SEE YOU” “OH THAT” “A LOT TO LOSE” “SMALL” “AND UH”) He recommended me this book — (“SAME”) The King James Only Controversy. (“HUH” “HE DID”)
D: Oh really?
Q: Have you read that?
D: No, I have not. (“STUBBORN” “THE MIDDLE” “SEE” “LISTEN” “SCARE” “YOU”)
Q: Let’s see. What was I going to ask you? (“WRITE IT DOWN”)
D: Your total is (“SO”) $18.32. (“AGAIN” “SUCK”)
Q: Okay. (“NO” “IT”) So, Danielle, are you any relation to Danielle Steel? (“JUST KIDDING”)
D: No. (“NO”)
Q: What’s your last name? (“HOLD” “DD”)
D: Brosthinsky. (“ALRIGHT”)
Q: Ooh, that’s an interesting name. Where are you from?
D: Yeah. Well, it’s my married name. (“WELL A” “SOME MAY” “PAINT” “PUSH”)
Q: Spell it. (“R” “NEWS” “WRONG”)
D: B — R — O — S — (“I CAME FOR YOU”) T — H — I — N — S — K — Y. (“UP AGAIN” “FIND” “A TEACHER” “MARK” “YOU KNOW WHO CAN DO” “A”)
Q: And what was your (“OM” “UH”) maiden name?
D: Robert. (“DEPENDS” “DO” “PLEASE NO”)
Q: Okay. (“MACK” “RIGHT” “WIN”) Two of the people I spoke to both had (“I LOVE YOU”) (son or) man (“NO”) in their name so I thought I would just check to see if anyone else did. (“HA HA” “SANDWICH” “A”) You probably know someone (“NINETEEN”) with man (“IN YOUR NAME” “COOL” “DO I”) or son or Michael in their name.
D: How are you doing, Johanna?
E: I’m doing really good.
E: You need to go get your lunch. (“I CAN’T” “YEAH”)
Q: I’m glad you’re making (“NARROW” “A GOOD”) some good money today. (“GET”) That will help — (“I”)
D: Yeah. (“THE CHURCH” “WILL HELP” “DEFINITELY”)
A: . . . when Debbie gets back I was going to go. (TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE SOUNDS HEARD ON THE TAPE HERE ARE OF A ROLL OF PENNIES BEING DISPENSED INTO CASH REGISTER.)
(“OH WERE YOU” “OKAY” “REMEMBER WE” “BS” “MAYBE WE”)
A: If we have two people, (“MY”) I’m not going to be able to do it. (“WELL” “WH”)
E: When you both — (“COME BACK I WILL”)
Q: Pennies from (“NO” “BELL” “MMMMMMM” “LIKE A” “BY”) heaven.
E: I’ll just go.
A: Okay, well, Virginia go ahead and go.
E: Now?
A: Yes. And then I’ll go when Debbie gets back.
D: $1.68 is your change. (“UH”)
Q: Okay, thank you.
D: You’re welcome. (“PER DAY”)
Q: What is Darryl’s last name? (“WE CAN”)
A: Aarons.
Q: Oh, that’s a real biblical name. (“KILL” “MOM” “AIR” “GAY” “ALL”)
A: Dad sits in the front. (“HE’S MY”)
Q: You might be the reincarnation of Aaron or something. (“YEAH” “I NEED” “LOVE” “I”) Okay, thank you.
D: Thank you. (“AS I” “THAT WILL BE LIKE” “HATED” “SON” “AA” “UH HAY HUH” “FIG”)
Q: Thank you, Jimmy.
J: Thank you. Nice meeting you. (“MY”) Your name? (“MA”)
Q: Mark Russell Bell. (“I” “WHO OWN IT”)
J: Nice to meet you, Mark.
Q: My friends call me Mabus for short. (“UH-HUH”) Can I have an extra one of these to give to a friend?
P: (infant) Dad. (“NO”) Oww.
J: Sure.
Q: Okay. (“MAKE”) Why don’t you just give me a package? Thank you. (“UH-HUH” “TWO HUNDRED”)
( . . . )
Q: (speaking into tape recorder in car) I don’t know why I asked for extra brochures. I guess I was just trying to be polite. I don’t know. What do you say when you go to one of these things? (“AND”) People seem so hopeless. In terms of reaching them. Anyway, I gave him my channeled questions to God and two pictures of the Ark of the Covenant. So my envelope does have my name and address on it. So he can write me if he wants. If he has any questions. (“OR”) I hope I just made him think a little bit. I’ll be very happy if I made him think a little bit. So I wonder if Lovey-Boo thinks I did a good job. (“IF ALL”) If I ask that question and play this tape back later, will I hear a ‘yeessss.’ (“SSS”) Or a ‘no.’ Or a ‘I don’t care.’ By the way, one of the photos I gave him of the Ark of the Covenant was the one that I took with the press kit for “The Ten Commandments” spread out along the bottom with the stills and everything. I thought that would be a nice touch. (“AND”) I made two sets when I had the photos made. Sotheby’s sent them back to me. They’re not very good photos. They’re just Kodak instamatic throwaway camera photos. But I think he’ll get the point (“IF HE GE[TS]”) if he even has a chance to read it. I guess he gets a lot of strange things. (“SO”) He might not get everything if you know what I mean. That might be his associate’s job to go through it first or something. I don’t know. He must get a lot of hate mail (“AAA”) or something. I just remembered something else that really made me mad last week. I was reading — I think it was in the Los Angeles Times. (“BUT”) Apparently the people in Holland want nuclear power because the windmills are too loud. Excuse me? I mean here in L.A. we all live within hearing distance, practically, of the freeway. And you get used to it. It’s no big deal. You admire the nature around you. (“BUT”) Jesus Christ! If I was living in beautiful Amsterdam or Holland I wouldn’t complain about the windmills. Get a life. Who wants a big nuclear reactor to meltdown in your backyard?
( . . . )
Q: I have to remind myself that the truth is very powerful and sometimes I actually feel like, “Oh, wow. I can do this or I can do that. (“BECAUSE”) I have the truth on my side.” (“AND”) And I kind of know I’m destroying people’s lives by telling them the truth. Especially like that guy back there. But I’m not really doing that, am I? I’m really saving them. (“SO”) But I can’t really sort of get drunk with power so that’s why I’m talking right now. Just to let you know it is a real struggle. When you (“SSS”) think you know the truth — who doesn’t? — you want to share it and you want other people to react the way you want them to do. Of course, we have had problems in the past (“DISMISS”) listening to people like that — like Hitler and, well, you know. So, that’s why I like — something like my book (“THAT”) lets me talk when I’m in different moods at different times. After having such wonderful love and awareness come into my life. I’m sort of (“WOR” “RY A”) more aware. (“I GUESS”) I wonder if Mighael will (“TWO OF [TH]EM”) want me to go see that new John Travolta movie “Phenomenon.” It seems very similar in some ways to my own story. I don’t really want to see it. I don’t. Unless Mighael wants me to see it, I don’t want to see it.
( . . . )
Q: (chanting/singing on my way home) Oh Ya Boo!
( . . .)
(“SO I”)
Q: (back at condo) I see that Hank wrote in my book, “(Eph 4:11-16)” so I guess that means God channeling through him wants me to include that in my book. (“KKK”) So I will read those verses to you from the King James Bible. Mine was a Christmas gift from my grandmother on December 25th, 1963. It says, “Merry Christmas to Mark Russell with love from Grandmother, Aunt Esther, Aunt Dorothy and Cousin Mary.” (reading from Holy Bible) “And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: (“TTT”) From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.”
( . . . )
Q: Well, I just opened up The King James Only Controversy by James R. White and listen to this. It’s my sentiments exactly. On page 38:
Q: (speaking into tape recorder) Karel Svoboda is the name of the artist and the year is 1931 written on the back of the canvas of the painting I just purchased today on my way to the gym. I dropped by Amanda Suzanne & Friends and she brought in a rare etching and a rare painting for me to see but I didn’t like it. The oil painting was very old yet it just didn’t ring any bells. (“UH-HUH” “SO”) I had gone next door first — (“UM”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: NEXT DOOR IS FAR CORNERS ANTIQUES & ART. THESE TWO ANTIQUE STORES ARE LOCATED ON NORTH LARCHMONT BOULEVARD ACROSS THE STREET FROM PARAMOUNT PICTURES.)
Q: — so, look, I visited two different stores where the owner had man in their names today. I wasn’t going to go next door but Dae Man Yang was outside with his little doggies and I just felt, “Well, (“HE MUST”) there must be a reason for this.” So I went in and, of course, there was a reason for this because I bought two beautiful small sculptures. I can’t even remember what he told (“THEM”) me about them. I don’t think he really knows much about them. One looks like it’s a little Mexican historical figure. (“RRE” “I GUESS SORT OF”) Sort of Toltec or Olmec — a beautiful green piece. (“CCE”) And I don’t know what the other one is made of — I showed it to Amanda next door and she didn’t know what it was either but it’s (“BEAU”) beautifully polished. And he gave me these two fascinating, original, beautiful pieces for $20 each. He forgot to give me a receipt. I paid cash. Oh, well. Let’s see — the bag he gave me to keep them in says “Total Beauty.” (“YEAH”) “Addy Total Beauty” (“YEAH”) is the bag. I guess it’s a makeshift bag. And I bought the painting for $350 plus $28.50 tax. So another wonderful day. I could have paid a lot more because she wanted $1,500 for the other one and there was another landscape that I kind of liked for $1,250. (“BUT IT JUST”) It just wasn’t quite — and there was another beautiful science fiction-type painting for $5,000. (“WITH A”) “With a signature” — as they say. (“BUT”) I like this one best and it was the least expensive of them all. There’s no accounting for taste. And I think she said it was from Yugoslavia. I also forgot my credit card there so I have to go back next Wednesday. I have a back-up card, not to worry. So the only thing else that’s new is that today in the newspaper and on the radio there’s news that oral sex (“XXX”) may pose a greater risk for HIV transmission than it was otherwise thought. I thought about this when it happened because I’m one of those listeners on the Hotline that always does not downplay the risk of oral sex. I know some of the other listeners sort of dismiss it all the time and I always cringe when I hear this but I don’t say anything because some people think they know everything and they know all the little trivia about HIV but they really blow it on the big issues and, of course, I’m really good when it comes to the big issues. So when this news came out today I felt like, “Oh my goodness, have I been doing things correctly?” and the answer was, “Yes, I have.” And I know there are a few other listeners who, oh my goodness, (“YEAH”) they’re going to start thinking, “How many people have I helped into their illness?” (“YEAH UH-HUH” “SO”) Again, I’m one of these people that knows the magnitude of every single interaction that we have in life. It makes life a lot more interesting but it (“ALL”) sort of keeps you on your toes. (“SO IS YOUR” “I MEAN IT’S”) Life is much more interesting now that I know Mighael’s here. I always want to be the best person I can be for myself and for Mighael. So (“OOO”) I’m going to (“TAKE”) go by the pool now for a little while. (“IT’S”) Because it’s the weekend and it’s hot. (“BUT FIRST”) And then when I come back I’ll say my little prayer or maybe I’ll say it when I’m in the pool. Oh well.
( . . . )
Q: So I forgot to say that Lovey-Boo did something very sweet yesterday at the party. (“YYY” “I”) It was dinnertime and Baba couldn’t come at the last moment so we were all kind of helping out organizing the dinner even though Charlotte did most of the work. (“KKK”) So I was kind of trying to help out where I could. Even though they didn’t think the rice was hot enough so they were going to microwave it and I said, “No,” because then all the nutrients will go out. So they left a portion of it for me and it tasted fine. It didn’t really need to be microwaved. (“BUT”) That was my own opinion and I ate from the non-microwaved rice. I can’t believe the things people argue about. (“SO”) Anyway, when I finally got my dinner and went to sit down, I realized I forgot to get one of the plastic forks. And where I had been sitting before there was a little plastic fork (“KKK”) on my dish of hors d’oeuvres. (“SSS”) I thought that was very sweet. And you can see why I’m so happily living here with Mighael. And tonight when I was eating dinner, “Because You Loved Me” performed by Celine Dion came on the radio followed by “Circle of Life” performed by Elton John. (“I MEAN JUST” “Y[OU]”) You know, it’s nice to hear loving songs from your dearest. (“AND I”) I forget sometimes (“THAT”) people like the romantic parts best. (“TTT”) I know I certainly do.
( . . . )
Q: So I didn’t get lost. I actually made it to the Christian Research Institute for their book sale. I’m just wearing a T-shirt, jeans and my “Messiah” cap. So I’m trying to find out information on successful ministries.
( . . . )
(“J”)
Q: I was wondering — I’m not that familiar with (“L” “C”) Christian Research Institute. What are they doing to help other humanity across the world?
J: That’s a good question. (“UH-HUH”) We basically are sort of an apologetics organization. (“NOTHING”)
Q: A what?
J: Apologetics.
Q: What does that mean?
J: Like we explain the truth of the Bible versus heretical teachings of other religions of the same — (“OH I SEE — OKAY” “BEAUTIFUL”) in other words, if somebody’s on the wrong path to God (“UH-HUH”) why, he’s condemned.
Q: Are we talking worship?
J: We’re talking saving. (“UH-HUH”)
Q: No, but I mean like helping in terms of (“HELP ME”) helping poverty and (“SHUH”) things like that. (“THANK YOU” “O HH”)
J: That’s — (“SIT HERE”) I think we go beyond (“HEY”) helping with poverty because (“RA”) people in poverty (“CAN’T HELP”) are in poverty because of God. I mean they don’t know God. (“IF HE WALKED IN”) That’s why they’re in poverty. (“BUT” “LEN”) You know what I’m trying to say? (“HEE-HAW”) Like (“COME BACK” “WHAT AM I”) we live and then we die and — well, the question is where do we go after we die? (“HEAR THAT POINT”)
Q: Right, so, see, but I think that God —
J: But if you —
Q: — wants people to help other people.
J: That’s right. But first you have to know Him and, well, see what He wants (“YEAH”) to do. (“OTHER PEOPLE”)
Q: I think there’s been too much worshiping and repetition (“YAHWEH”) of mindless prayer. (“NO”)
J: Well, that’s — oh, you’re talking about tradition. I’m talking about — see, Christianity’s not a religion. (“WELL THAT” “UNCLE” “YOU’RE MY SKIN”) It’s a relationship with God, you know? (“W” “THE STING”)
Q: Right. (“LISTEN”)
J: And knowing God. (“NO”) And knowing what He wants us to do in life. (“UM-HUH”)
Q: What’s your last name, (“KNOW THAT” “U”) by the way? (“COCTEAU”)
J: Harmanczis. (“GAY” “BILL”)
Q: Where are you from?
J: Greece. (“HOME”)
Q: What is that last name? (“YOUR PROBLEM”) Spell that. I’m not good at Greek names.
J: Okay. (“I DO”) It’s a long name. (“KEVIN” “BLACK”)
J: H — A — R — M — A — N — (“KNEE”) C — Z — I — S.
Q: M — A — N? As in Son of Man? (“MONEY ON” “W”)
J: (small laugh) (“STOP”)
Q: Get it?
J: Son of Man. Yes. (“TROLL” “N”)
Q: Oh, okay. Well, that’s good. (“CORPSE”) I mean I — (“I WAS”)
J: So the thing is — (“I MIGHT LOVE YOU” “TAKE IT”)
Q: Who is this guy over here (“YOU’RE GAY”) that all these people (“BETTER”) are waiting in line (“OF THE”) to see?
J: That’s the president of the company.
Q: What’s his name? (“NOW HURRY”)
J: Hank Hanegraaff. (“HENDRIK” “OF THE COMPANY”) The guy here?
Q: Is he good? Is he a nice guy? (“OSLO” “YEAH”)
J: Yeah, he answers all the questions on the show. (“BROKEN ARM”) Listen to him? (“OH I’M” “MAYBE THIS” “COAST” “YEAH”)
Q: Those shows are so funny — (“BECAUSE OF THE” “WHERE’S THE” “I”) the callers are such (“THE”) wackos. (“BEDTIME” “YEAH” “HURRY”)
J: Oh, you listen to it? (“GRIN”) Because the largest — (“OUT OF STEAM” “MY FATHER”)
Q: I heard it — (“LAST WEEK” “PULLED A”) I heard last week and this guy was going to kill himself (“A BOMB” “LIT” “YEAH”) unless this guy talked to him. (“COMMON” )
J: Yeah, but see what I’m saying? (“MONDAY” “WALK”) Also he has —
Q: I listen (“LISTEN TO”) to him on the way home from the gym unless I’m late — (“LIKE TAKE A”)
J: Yeah.
Q: — then I listen to the guy who comes on after him — (“DEBORAH” “YOU’RE SO” “GOOD”) Chuck Missler.
J: But basically we just sort truth from error and we help people discern it for themselves. (“THAT’S RIGHT” “HEARD YOU’RE JEWISH”)
Q: I’m not going to ask him what I asked you (“SMART”) because he’ll just give me a hard time. (“OHH”) I’m going to ask him a more theoretical question. (“COCHRAN”) He’s more comfortable with that. (“YEAH”)
J: You can ask him any question you want. (“OKAY” “AS HE” “YALL HIS OVER” “POEM”)
Q: Is there a time limit? (“UH-HUH” “CARLY”)
J: Well, I don’t know. People will give you a time limit. (“THE FAMILY” “KNEW” “DAVID”)
Q: I better get in line. Right? (“YEAH”) But, wait, what’s the best (“TELL US”) books to get?
J: Well, it depends (“HOW”) on what you want.
Q: Okay. (“BOND”) Do you have any books that are (“SEE”) funny like God and Jesus — (“COME ON”) like maybe Jesus (“GA”) was mad at God or something? (“ARE YOU INSANE”)
J: No, see because that’s not — to us (“PAY”) Christians — not funny.
Q: No, but funny. Funny. I like funny things. (“LIKE WHAT IT DOES”)
J: See, (“THE THROW”) you may think that now — (“I NEED HELP” “VITAMIN”) like you say that’s how people (“ARE” “ALI”) that publish all that stuff —
Q: Um-huh. (“UH-HUH”)
J: — but that’s really not what people (“PEOPLE”) need. (“ONLY A DOCTOR” “CALL KYM” “A REAL”) First you need God. (“YEAH”) Then you can help them see — but if you — let me give you an example. (“WITH THE”) If you (“CALL ME”) got to, (“THE MOST”) let’s say, a religious person — (“NO WAY AT ALL”) right? And just go out helping people — (“OH NO HE HASN’T SEEN HIM YET”) right? And you don’t believe in God? (“HMM” “RIGHT NOW”) Then it’s all for nothing.
Q: But I just think (“US”) God would rather have people (“NO” “OH YEAH”) helping other people — (“PRETTY GOOD” “LOVE ME”)
J: Let me explain.
Q: — than worshiping Him. (“WITHIN US” “POETRY”)
J: If you don’t know God, right, and you die? (“THE STRUGGLE”) You go straight to hell, right? (“OR LINGER” “GOD”)
Q: Not necessarily. (“THE” “DON’T BE GLIB” “NUT”)
J: Now God says so. (“SUPPOSE” “SO” “EVIDENCE”) Unless you think God is —
Q: You mean Jesus said so. (“GOOD POINT” “VASECTOMY” “LOOK OUT”) Because Jesus invented hell.
J: And God in the Bible — no. (“ONE” “FF”) If you look at — (“MY SON”) read the Bible —
Q: Well, I’m writing a book —
J: — the Bible says —
Q: — and I want you to read it when it comes out. (“THAT’S WRITTEN”)
J: — that (“FOR” “WHO’S THAT”) hell is created for the Devil (“NICE”) and his angels. God gave man free choice. (“IS NOW” “OKAY”)
Q: Yeah, but these were metaphors.
J: No, not metaphors.
Q: Well, I’m going to (“TALK”) get in line to speak to him. (“THE MOVIE”) If you want to come talk to me while I’m in line, fine.
J: That’s okay.
Q: Okay.
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: I INTERVIEWED SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN THE LINE.)
Q: What did she say (“MY”) about evolution versus (“GAY”) creationism? (“MIGHAEL” “THEY COME”)
T: I wasn’t paying attention. (“I KNOW BUT SHE” “YEAH”)
Q: Oh. (“HOW TRUE”) What do you think? (“GOD” “ANDY” “ONE” “UNDER TYRANNY”)
T: I don’t know.
Q: I think that God invented (“TIME TO GO HOME” “ONLY TWO”) evolution. (small laugh) (“ONLY BY” “UH-HUH”) That’s the easy way, I think, (“LAWYER”) of explaining it. (ROAR “THE JURY” “YOU KNOW” “NOT SO GOOD”)
T: Good, huh? (“I’VE SEEN IT” “TALL”)
Q: Oh my goodness. Wait, what’s your name? (“HARVEY” “THIR” “TEEN”)
T: Ted. (“CARRY OFF”)
Q: Are you from here? L.A.? (“COLON”)
T: I was. (“LOVE TO YOU”) I moved out of here. (“I” “YOU HATE”)
Q: Oh really? (“HEART”) Where did you go?
T: San Diego. (“WHAT” “UM-HUH”)
Q: How is it? It’s not as crowded. (“SKULL” “Y. S. Q.” “WOOD”)
T: Yeah. (“WE”) Its nicer too. (“OH” “KISS MY” “GRITS”) Different. (“HOME”) And warmer too. (“UM-HUH” “MMMMMMM MMMMMMM”)
Q: And what’s your ancestry? (“A NUMEROUS”)
T: Filipino. (“SON” “FILIPINO” “I HAVEN’T GOTTEN OVER PAIN . . .” “UM-HUH”)
Q: What’s (“WHAT”) your last name? (“THEN I” “THEY’RE INCREASING”)
T: Talupn. (“KNEE” “O” “WE’RE THE”)
Q: Spell that. (“I JUST FLEW THE” “NOTHING”)
T: T — A — (“L U”) L — U — P — N. (“MADE”)
Q: And what does that mean? (“PROFITABLE” “I” “I HAVE”)
T: I have no idea. (“SAVE ONE FOR ME” “MY HO”) That’s just a name. (“WHEN” “Y” “COLD FEET” “PREGNANT” “JEW” “MAYAN” “DISCO”)
Q: Um-huh. (“UR” “THEY’D LIKE A BIT” “YOU” “BUT THEY BUY” “CREDENZA”) My name’s Russell (“TWO MORE”) and I always forget the original name it comes from too. (“DON’T LOOK NOW” “NEW TRICK”) My mother’s maiden name was King. (“WHO IN THE HELL WAS THAT” “YOUR TONGUE” “HERE”) That’s an easy one. (“I’VE HEARD IT TOO” “CYNIC” “COMPLETELY” “CUTS” “THE FAN MAIL” “I REMEMBER” “BUT” “WHEN” “FOR YOU”) Russell is (“RIGHT”) something — (“DU”) I keep saying ‘du Rose’ but it’s not. It’s something else. (“LEAVE YOUR LIGHTS ON” “UHH” “WE TAKE THEM” “NO COMMENT”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: LE ROZEL IS THE NAME THAT BECAME RUSSELL.)
Q: Look at that T-shirt that says “His pain your gain.” (“LOVE YOU”) Ohh, it’s gross. Blood. (“BE NO PAIN” “DADDY” “YOU’RE”) I’m very squeamish. (“OF THAT” “YOU’RE VERY” “I LOVE YOU”)( . . . )
Q: Excuse me, have you been (“NO” “HERE”) to one of these sales before? (“DEFINITELY NO” “YOU HEAR THAT” “AM I IN HELL” “YOU USE UP” “THINK ABOUT” “I’LL HOLD IT” “IHH” “UHH” “AM FINE”)
(CUE)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE PERSON I TRIED TO INTERVIEW HADN’T HEARD ME AND WALKED ON.)
(“DOES IT”)
Q: That’s nice. Somebody’s got to do it.
C: Um-huh. (“THE”)
Q: What church do you go to? (“OH”)
C: Calvary Chapel, Chino Valley. (“I GUESS” “I MISS” “CHINO VALLEY” “HOW ARE YOU”)
Q: Well, I’m not familiar with that —
C: David Rosales. (“TO US” “IT HURTS” “YEAH” “WE’LL NEVER GET OVER IT”)
Q: What denomination is that? (“HOLY” “GROWING”) Non-denomination? (“AL” “I WANT TO PRESS CHARGES”)
C: Yeah. Christians. (“YEAH”) Jesus Christ. (“ACQUITTAL”)
Q: Yeah. (“WILL BE”)
C: (laughs) (“AT HOME” “WHAT DID I”)
Q: Exactly.
C: That’s it. (“THE” “YEAH” “OKAY” “THAT FAR DOWN” “FOR A LITTLE” “OH BOY”)
Q: I go to the Philosophical (“YEAH”) Research (“THROW ME A BOOK” “I WONDER”) Society (“WITH A GUN”) in L.A. It’s (“IT DOESN’T MATTER”) wonderful. (“RECORDED” “CAN’T WAIT” “SSS” “IMPORTANT”) They have somebody (“SOLD A”) different (“RIGHT”) speak every week. (“YEAH” “FINANCIAL” “SO WHY”) So it’s (“COME AGAIN” “WATER”) always interesting. (“FOREIGN” “TEST”) It’s only an hour so (“I’LL DREAM” “I’M WORRIED” “BELL” “WHOA”) you still have the whole day (“OUTCOME”) ahead. (“BOND” “TO CONCLUDE” “I’M HERE TO FIND OUT WHEN” (“ABOUT LOVE” “YEAH” “THE” “I LISTEN” “HERE” “POET” “GREAT” “FRONT OF YOU” “THAT’S THE WAY I SEEM” “CODA”) By the way, what’s your name? (“BILL” “MINDY” “DEAD”)
C: Chris. (“I HEAR” “WILL BE” “I DON’T WANT”)
Q: As in Christ. (“YOU’RE RIGHT” “I DID NOT”)
C: (small laugh) (“SLOW DOWN”) No, (“SO”) but — (small laugh) (“YOU LIE”)
Q: What’s your last name? (“GO AHEAD”)
C: Bumpus. (“MELON” “DEGREES”)
Q: B — U — M — P — U — S? (“L A”)
C: Yeah. (“PASSING” “GOOD DAY”)
Q: Bump us (“BIG S”) in the night.
C: Like to ‘bump us.’ (“DIVORCE”)
Q: Things that go bump us.
C: That’s right. (small laugh) (“IN THE NIGHT” “BAD” “MOOD” “I LOVE YOU” “FUN” “SAY” “UUUUHHH” “VULGAR”)
Q: Ohhh. (“LIZZIE” “GARCIA” “WOWNER” “PADRE” “DAY” “I’M GAY” “NOW TICKLE ME” “HE DOES THAT” “GOD’S IN A LOT OF TROUBLE” “SHAMPOO” “YEAH” “HIS OWN”)
C: She’s got the book they gave us free (“A BIG HURRY”) for buying the tapes. (“BONE” “LUCKY” “VITAMIN”)
Q: What is it?
C: I mean — I’m sorry — (“THAT”) The Christian Research Journal. (“WANT “ENJOY” “ME”)
Q: What is that? Is that one I’d be interested in? (“RUSS” “RING” “OUT” “CITY”) I can’t read it even. (“UTMO[ST]”) My —
C: Utmost for His Highest (by Oswald Chambers).
Q: — Utmost for His Highest. I’m trying to think of a really tough question (“DOOR”) to ask him. (“HONEY”)
C: I don’t know. (“I FOUND” “WELL HE”) I’ve only seen one guy stump him.(“RIGID”)
Q: Really? What was the question? (“MAY”)
C: I don’t even remember. (“UH” “OH” “MET AT A” “BABY”) But I’ll find out for you. (“WE’RE THE COACH” “OKAY” “WELL IT’S NO[T]” “I WOU[LD]”)
Q: I like — (“TO ASK”)
C: He’s an — (“HE’S” “DON’T LIE”)
Q: — to ask theoretical questions.
C: — extremely (“WAS” “WAS”) straightforward (“BUT” “THINK REASONABLY”) and if he don’t know he’ll say, (“WHY”) “You know what? I don’t know. (“IF I”) I’ll find out.” But (“CAN’T AGREE” “THROUGH THEIR”) he knew how (“LET THEM GO” “THERE IS A WAY” “USING”)
Q: He’s usually right.
C: — I’ve only had one guy. (“DAMN IT” “NO” “I MEAN” “IT CA[N]” “FOR HIM”)
Q: The Bible is so (“BUT”) confusing and so complicated. (“IF THEY””ONE OF A” “WHY”)
C: He’s so good at it, though. He has — (“YOU’RE OWN” “GOOD” “LAW” “LIKE”) I think it’s Proverbs that (“WHAT A WORLD”) he has totally (“GOOD MORNING” “HAUNT”) memorized. (“THE TWO” “GOLDEN”)
Q: Oh my God. (“WE CARE” “DOUBLE” “I THINK HEN” “PROVERBS” “THE” “A E” “TOYS IN OUR”) I don’t remember my Social Security number. (“MAY I” “LOVER” “BOY” “UM-HUH”)
C: Me neither. I carry — (small laugh) (“PAID”/”I” “FUN”/”I” “ORDER”/”I”) I think that’s what it is. (“YEAH”/”I” “PUT HIM IN”) So I think the Proverbs. (“I DON’T DOUBT IT” “RIGHT” “MAY WE” “GONNA SOCK” “WHEN” “ONE TOE”) Every year I think he says (“TODAY I WAS” “YEAH”) he tries to memorize (“DEFEND”) one book. (“MOTHER A” “PRAY” “MY MOM”) That’s his goal, (“EIEUUUU”) I think. (“WHERE’S MY” “I” “I HAVE” “TREATMENT” “WHAT” “THE GOAL”)
Q: What if God came out (“OR HE”) with a new bible? (“HE’S NOT THERE” “HATE”) He’d have to start all over. (“NEW BIBLE”)
C: Well, (“A NEW”) we know that’s not going to happen. (“I KNOW HIM” “SO”)
Q: No, we don’t. (“UHH”) We don’t know anything. (“HER SUCKIN” “DON’T KNOW” “YOU’RE THE THING” “YEAH” “ROLE” “A DODO” “A CAP”)( . . . ) (“DO THEY COME IN HERE”)
Q: There are so many flies buzzing around (“AROUND”) here. (“GOING TO TALK TOO” “YEAH” “TICK”) Such a pain. (“IN HERE” “GET TO WEAR IN [PHONETIC] MARNEBURG” “ALL I KNOW” “REPORT”)
( . . . )
(“WE’RE THE” “I CAN” “HERE I COME”)
Q: Hi, Hank. It’s so nice to meet you. (“THEY ALL”)
H: Nice to meet you.
Q: I feel as if I know you. (“HURRAH”) I always listen to you on the way home from the gym.
H: Oh, great.
Q: And you deal with so many difficult cases. I really have lots of sympathy with you. So, anyway, I was thinking of a good question while I was in line. And the lady behind me helped me come up with — and I would never put you on the spot (“UH-HUH”) on the radio broadcast. (“THIS IS”) This question is really too hard. (“OH THAT’S LIKE” “MINE”) But what if God were to say, “Okay, (“THEY’LL LOVE YOU”) here’s a new Bible (“THANKS SO MUCH”) and the old one is no longer valid. (“THEY’LL”) But here’s a new one for you and I want you to spread its word.” What would you do?
H: Well, first of all, — (“THE”)
Q: And He’d have proof. Like He’d give His new Jesus or whatever, like, the Ark of the (“LET”) Covenant or something.
H: Okay, here’s the problem with the question. The problem with the question is (“SAY THE”) you’re asking me, (“THE” “UH OH”) “What if (“WHY”) a triangle (“BECOME”) suddenly became (“I”) a circle?”
Q: Right.
H: What would you call it?
Q: Um-huh. That’s what I’m doing.
H: Yeah.
Q: Yeah.
H: You see — (“THE — HE”)
Q: No, but I’m not saying — (“I MEAN YOU CAN DO”) not to base this on — this is just from your heart you can answer this. (“YEAH”)
H: No, I am answering it. (“AA”)
Q: Oh, okay.
H: By using that as an example. (“BUT IT”) But a triangle by definition is a triangle — can never become a circle. (“A DOLLAR” “YOU HA[VE]” “YOU”)
Q: Does that mean (“RIGHT” “YOUR”) your mind is totally closed to any possibility? (“LIKE” “WHO THE HELL”)
H: No. (“THAT’S RIGHT” “WHA[T]”) What I’m saying — (“IGNORE” “DD” “STAY THERE” “CRY” “NO” “SOLEMN”) follow the reasoning.
Q: Okay. (“DEMAND” “THE”)
H: If in fact (“BROUGHT” “DAY”) you have a triangle, (“THIS”) it can never become a circle — (“UH-HUH”) right?
Q: Well, you have the Father, son and the Holy Ghost.
H: No no no no, I’m not talking about that.
Q: Oh, okay. (“I”)
H: I’m just talking about geometry figures right now.
Q: Right.
H: Okay? (“TOO VIOLENT”) A triangle can never become a circle. (“AA”)
Q: Okay.
H: Right? (“[O]KAY WELL I MEAN”)
Q: Okay, this is a waste of time to ask that question.
H: No, it’s not a waste of time. (“OKAY” “WE’RE ALL” “IT’S A” “POOH”) A triangle can’t change — (“THE” “IN”)
Q: But what if God — (“CIRCLE”) God can do anything. (“FOR ME”)
H: But, no, God cannot change His nature. (“THAT’S”) Nature does not change.
Q: He’s love.
H: But His nature never changes. (“AA” “MY” “THAT’S OKAY” “THEY’RE TRUE”)
Q: Right.
H: God’s nature — (“DO MY”) in other words, (“COP OUT”) it’s like asking can God (“A TO Z” “THEY BELONG” “YOU’RE A BAD”) even make a stone so big He can’t carry it. It’s a confusion of categories. (“SUPERMAN” “NUMBER ONE”)
Q: I thought it was very clear. (“HHH” “GAM” “BY THE WAY WHAT”) The only thing, see — (“UH HH”) recently I’ve been sort of losing respect for Jesus — I know that sounds terrible but (“WE”) because I look around and I see (“YEAH”) no one really following his word. They just sort of pay him lip service and they don’t really help their fellow (“WWW”) man. (“GIVE A”) So he’s sort of an underachiever. (“OR A”) He’s sort of a failure. (“AND I”) I’m having difficulty with that. (“WHAT” “OU” “WWW”)
H: How does that — (“AA” “ME”) why would you have difficulty with that?
Q: Because everything that Jesus taught no one’s doing so He must not have been (“YEAH”) a very good teacher. (“NEW ONE” “LOOK AT THE” “BUT I MEAN” “THEY DO”)
H: That does not (“THEY DO”) reflect on His teachings (“IN THE”) at all. (“TAUGHT”) I mean what you need to do (“ASPIRIN”) is evaluate His teachings — (“THEY” “YEAH”) based on His teachings. (“TEST ME”)
Q: Yeah. (“CALL ME”) But I think we’re all sort of, you know, the sons of God (“DDD”) so (POWER”) I can respect him for his (“TRADE”) valiant effort. (“MEANING”) I mean it’s probably too much for any one person to fulfill. (“DO WE”)
H: He was God. It’s not too much for God to do. (“SON”)
Q: Well, we’re all God. (“THE THREE” “YOU HATE HIM”)
H: Well, you may think (“DDHARTHA”) you’re God —
Q: No, we’re all — you know, God is in all of us. (“US” “OH DEAR”)
H: Well — (“OKAY”) that’s a different proposition than saying that we’re all God.
Q: But I think Jesus would have said that.
H: Well, that’s one thing to think. (“HIGHER” “MY CA[P]”)
Q: I mean he had —
H: So it’s not true.
Q: — you know — (“I MEAN HE”)
H: It’s not what He said. (“COME HERE”)
Q: He’s like all of us. I mean he had bad teeth. (“SO”) And bad skin (“CLEAR”) probably. (“HAPPEN” “MY” “AN[D]”)
Q: Bad — probably — B. O. (“BUT UM” “BUT IN THE BIBLE”) What if He said, “Okay, Jesus is a metaphor and here’s a new Jesus.” (“IN ME”) And (“NO”) here’s a new Bible. (“YES”)
H: Well, God can’t go against (“OH GET REAL”) His nature. (“I FEEL” “BUT”)
Q: But what if He wasn’t? What if He was just revealing (“YOU”) that some of his (“DOUBLE”) dogma was metaphor? (“HE KNOWS” “I”)
H: Well, what if you were (“I WAS”) an ant? (“HELP”) You’re not. (“SORRY”)
Q: Well, — (“THAT’S”)
H: I mean —
Q: — yeah. No, I’m just posing an (“EDEN” “OTHER WORDS” “COUNTRY”) interesting question.
H: In other words, you can stand here and say that you’re a gopher or an ant.
Q: But what if — (“OKAY”)
H: That doesn’t make you a gopher or an ant.
Q: — this new Jesus had the Ark of the (“OF THE”) Covenant and (“I”) said, “Okay, look, I own the Ark of the (“OF THE”) Covenant — (“OH YEAH”) God gave me (“OKAY”) the Ark of the Covenant (“MIGHAEL”) as proof (“THAT” “I”) that I am Son of Man” (“GO[D]”) or something? (“OR A” “HOW”)
H: But my point is — (“WE KNOW”) and that’s why I tried (“GO”) to start out by trying to have your mind click in to the logical fallacy of saying that a triangle can never become a circle. (“PARADIGM”) It can’t because if a triangle (“OH I GOT IT” ) were a circle you wouldn’t call it a triangle you’d call it a (“AA”) circle. The same thing with God’s nature — (“IN HELL”) you cannot take God’s (“AA”) nature —
Q: Um-huh.
H: — and change God’s nature (“YOU’RE READY”) or you can’t (“UM-HUH”) take your (“HAIL THE”) nature and (“I”) change it and be logically consistent. So if I start talking to you as though you’re an ant —
Q: Well, I’m more emotional than logical. (“LLL” “STAY”)
H: Huh?
Q: I admit that I’m much more of a loving — (“KILL” “LIE”) I mean (“AAL”) emotional person. Logic and science are just (“LOOK AT”) too much for me to (“WORRY”) worry about. (“BE SURE”)
H: Well, but —
Q: But I do think God is love.
H: — you can’t consistently live in this world if you were not logical to some degree.
Q: Oh, well (“I MEAN”) I’m very logical.
H: Yeah. (“SAY”) Oh, you just said (“BUT”) you weren’t.
Q: No, but I know (“YOU’RE” “I MEAN”) the emphasis is (“PUT”) on my emotions and what I feel in my heart. (“I”) And I feel in my heart that if Jesus were to somehow (“I”) come back today he’d tell everyone to stop (“DO IT”) worrying about dogma and ministry and really (“JUST” “DO”) put all their efforts into helping other people. (“BUT”)
H: But then why —
Q: That’s much more loving.
H: — did Jesus not (“YEAH”) say that? (“WRONG”)
Q: But who knows what he said? (“WELL WE”) We just have this book that’s gone through twenty different (“RIGHT”) variations over the years. (“UH NO”)
H: Well, that’s — (“I” “SELL” “WELL” “RIGHT”) what you’re saying’s simply not true.
Q: No, but I mean there were the — (“HOW”)
H: See, he’s making stuff up. (“NO”)
Q: No, I’m not.
H: Yes, you are.
Q: I’m just saying —
H: You said it went through twenty different revisions?
Q: Yeah. (“HE’S RIGHT”)
H: So where did you come up with that? (“MINE”)
Q: There’s a book I read. (“IT”)
H: How do you know it’s true?
Q: Manly Hall wrote this book about the evolution of the Bible.
H: How do you know it’s true? (“WET” “BE MY” “CAUSE IT”)
Q: I don’t have the book with me.
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE BIBLE: THE STORY OF A BOOK BY MANLY P. HALL IS PUBLISHED BY THE PHILOSOPHICAL RESEARCH SOCIETY, INC.)
(“BUT”)
H: But how do you know it’s true? (“EIGHTY-THREE”)
Q: Okay, King James, for example, who was a (“OCCU”) dabbler in the occult, was the one who (“TOOK IT ALL”) was responsible for the King James version. (“THIS”)
H: So what? (“THE”)
Q: Well, see, — (“PLAY” “SEE WHAT A”)
H: The question is that is it — (“BLAME” “FAMILY TALK” “I”) I don’t care if he was Attila the Hun.
Q: Right.
H: Did the work that he had commissioned (“I TOLD YOU”) in 1604 — (“OKAY”) was that done precisely or was it not done precisely? That’s the question. (“AND SO”)
Q: Nothing’s perfect. (“I” “WE[LL]” “TO SAY” “POINT”)
H: The way you check that (“CAMERA”) out (“AROUND” “ME”) is you go back (“NO”) to the manuscript evidence and you test (“OF THE” “BELL”) the work of James the First by the manuscript evidence. (“RIGHT”)
Q: Right. What is that?
H: Okay? Well, you look at the manuscript evidence. You look at archaeological evidence. (“CYCLE”) You see (“ADA”) if, in fact, the manuscripts themselves that we have (“LABOR”) are consistent with the interpretation and the translation. (“OKAY”)
Q: Are there any books on that?
H: Sure. There are lots of them. In fact, there’s a good (“UH-HUH”) book (“RIGHT”) that we have right here —
Q: Okay.
H: — on the King James version. (“WHO” “NO”) You should read it. (“GOYA”)
Q: Okay, my horoscope said to tell whoever I spoke to today — (“OH”)
H: You shouldn’t be listening to horoscopes.
Q: — to (“SEE THE”) put up or shut up. (“A” “HE DID”) You know, so I guess I’ll have to check out that book. What’s the title again? (“HARASS” “UM”)
H: What — what’s the — (“WANT” “ROMEO”) James White’s book?
P: The King James Only Controversy.
H: Yeah. King James Only. (“WET” “SO WE HAVE A” “I” “YOU”)
Q: Will you get that for me?
P: I’ll take you over and show you where it is.
Q: Okay, fine. Okay. (“THE”)
P: I’ll take you over there.
Q: And, let’s see, what else was I going to ask you? Oh, I also (“I HAVE THIS” “A”) wanted to give you this. These are some polaroids — and I know I was bad — I know you think it’s bad but I went to a channeler and tried to speak to God. (“THE”)
H: Okay, why don’t you (“YOU”) give it to him?
Q: Okay fine. (“OKAY”) It’s very interesting. (“I DON’T THINK LIKE”)
P: Let’s go over and look for that book.
Q: Okay. (“OKAY”)
P: Okay.
Q: Nice meeting you. (“SOME” “THAT’S ME”) Oh, you didn’t autograph my book.
H: Sure. Be happy too.
Q: I’m so in agreement that Christianity is in crisis. God has to do something. He has to. There’s so much pain and suffering in the world. (“I”) It just breaks my heart. (“THANK YOU” “OKAY” “FOR US” “SORRY”)
H: Well, you can be part of the solution. (“THANK YOU”)
Q: Oh, I plan to be. (“PAINT BRUSH”) Thank you.
H: You’re welcome.
P: Let’s go and look for the —
Q: Okay. (“BOOK” “WHOA” “THAT HURT” “FIND” “I” “I”) What’s your name? Paul?
P: Young. (“I MEAN”)
Q: Young?
P: Right. (“QUIET” “HE’S THE MANAGER”) Thanks for coming to see us. (“TODAY”)
Q: You know — I’m trying to think. (“I HAVE ONE” “YEAH”) I might have — (“I’M A”) We might be cousins (“CLOSE”) because (“I BECAME” “THE”) there’s a Young in my family tree.
P: Really? (“CHECK”)
Q: I think so. (“BOOK”) Unless I’m getting confused.
P: Yeah? (“YOU ARE A”) Okay. (“BUY” “ELLEN” “SKY” “LOOK AT MY” “PROBLEM”) Do we have The King James Only Controversy? (“WRECK” “HURRY”) The James White book? (“ADD UP” “HOME”)
S: I believe so. (“NOW BUY” “A STORY”)
P: I think there is.
S: Over here. (“RIGHT” “BELL”) Let me go look.
P: Hank was suggesting White.
Q: Okay, great. (“DICK”) Thank you.
S: Yes.
Q: Okay. Thank you, Paul. (“BENNY PUBLISH” “THE”)
P: Okay, great. (“UHHHHHH”)
Q: And where do I pay for these?
P: It’s right back over here.
Q: Okay. (“WOOD”)
S: We’ll get the book and then (“BUY”) you’ll be able to take it up front.
Q: Okay, fine, (“READY”) Scott.
S: The King James Controversy — $7. (“I DO” “POPPINS”) If it’s not here, I’ll run up and —
Q: Okay. (“FOR YOU”)
S: — in the bookstore. Here it is.
Q: Oh, good. Oh, thank you. (“BE GOOD” “YOU’RE” “LIVING”)
S: That’ll help you out. (“HELL” “DYING”)
Q: White. James R. White.
S: James White. (“RIGHT” “PERRIER”)
Q: Who’s he?
S: Now there was some — (“EVERYDAY”) he was interviewed on the broadcast as well. I don’t know if you side with this school (“BROWN”) but he lives in Arizona. (“NO” “DIE” “UH-HUH”) But Hank interviewed him on “The Bible Answer Man” as well. (“HA[NK] HA[NK] HA[NK]” “CALL THE” “HA HA HA” “I” “QUITE A BIG”) And there are (“I”) some cassettes of him being interviewed. (“GOT HER THE RING”)
Q: Oh, it looks like Hank’s real name is Hendrik. (“THEY WATCH”) Where’s that (“DRUG” “WHAT”) from? (“IS HE”)
S: Dutch.
Q: Dutch. (“NO” “A AA”)
S: He’s Dutch. (“IRELAND”) Yeah. (“SAW”)
Q: I’m writing a book that (“BE”) looks at ancestry and what-have-you so that’s why I’m always asking people (“FOR”) their names.
S: Alright. Yeah. (“I”)
Q: Scott, what’s your last name? (“EVERY”)
S: Larson. (“PUT A” “OKAY”)
Q: L — A — R — S — O — (“O”) N?
S: S — O. Yeah. (“EVERY”)
Q: Son of Man. Another Son of Man name. (“WHAT” “GALLERY”)
S: Okay, it is. (“OH” “GUESS” “DREAM”)
Q: Uh-huh. (“SLOW” “ONE MORE”)
S: Okay.
Q: Lucky you.
S: Yeah.
Q: What are you reading? (“OH I”)
S: Actually, I’m needing to bring this back — (“DON’T DO IT RIGHT”) a print to the bookstore. (“PAPERBACK”)
Q: Oh, okay. (“ONE” “SO”) You’re not reading Islam.
S: No.
Q: You’re a Christian.
S: No. (“YEAH” “FAMOUS” “FACE” “OKAY”)
Q: Okay, thank you.
S: At least today.
Q: Okay. (“YOUNG” “TAKE IT”) Do you also have any funny comedic books? (“I CAN’T” “LIKE” “DO YOU”) Like jokes between Jesus and God or anything funny?
S: No. (“NO”) Nothing. (“SON”)
Q: Okay.
S: Just strictly (“NO” “YEAH”) Bible teaching. (“I” “BURNING”)
Q: Okay, thank you. (“YOU’RE IT”)
S: Thank you. (“FOR GOD”)
Q: I’ll look around.
( . . . )
(“NOTHING BUY HER” “STRAW” “MAD”)
Q: Hi, Danielle. (“THE BLOOD” “BY THE”) By the way, it says (“SAYS”) “Have you subscribed to the Journal?” Are they free subscriptions or —
D: No, they’re not. (“WE’RE MAKING”) They’re $20 for one year, $37 for — (“TOO HIGH AMOUNT”)
Q: Okay, I’ll pass. (“OKAY”)
D: Okay.
Q: I have a very (“NEW”) limited attention span. (“O-OH” “DO YOU” “OKAY”)
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: COMMENTS FROM PEOPLE AT THE PURCHASING COUNTER ARE DESIGNATED ‘P’ WHILE UNIDENTIFIED EMPLOYEES ARE DESIGNATED ‘E.’)
P: We’re getting one of these free.
D: Oh, cool. Yeah. (“UM-HUH”)
Q: (sighs)
D: Okay. Thank you. (“HEAVEN”)
Q: Hank was very nice. (“NO” “US” “L S” “SEE YOU” “OH THAT” “A LOT TO LOSE” “SMALL” “AND UH”) He recommended me this book — (“SAME”) The King James Only Controversy. (“HUH” “HE DID”)
D: Oh really?
Q: Have you read that?
D: No, I have not. (“STUBBORN” “THE MIDDLE” “SEE” “LISTEN” “SCARE” “YOU”)
Q: Let’s see. What was I going to ask you? (“WRITE IT DOWN”)
D: Your total is (“SO”) $18.32. (“AGAIN” “SUCK”)
Q: Okay. (“NO” “IT”) So, Danielle, are you any relation to Danielle Steel? (“JUST KIDDING”)
D: No. (“NO”)
Q: What’s your last name? (“HOLD” “DD”)
D: Brosthinsky. (“ALRIGHT”)
Q: Ooh, that’s an interesting name. Where are you from?
D: Yeah. Well, it’s my married name. (“WELL A” “SOME MAY” “PAINT” “PUSH”)
Q: Spell it. (“R” “NEWS” “WRONG”)
D: B — R — O — S — (“I CAME FOR YOU”) T — H — I — N — S — K — Y. (“UP AGAIN” “FIND” “A TEACHER” “MARK” “YOU KNOW WHO CAN DO” “A”)
Q: And what was your (“OM” “UH”) maiden name?
D: Robert. (“DEPENDS” “DO” “PLEASE NO”)
Q: Okay. (“MACK” “RIGHT” “WIN”) Two of the people I spoke to both had (“I LOVE YOU”) (son or) man (“NO”) in their name so I thought I would just check to see if anyone else did. (“HA HA” “SANDWICH” “A”) You probably know someone (“NINETEEN”) with man (“IN YOUR NAME” “COOL” “DO I”) or son or Michael in their name.
D: How are you doing, Johanna?
E: I’m doing really good.
E: You need to go get your lunch. (“I CAN’T” “YEAH”)
Q: I’m glad you’re making (“NARROW” “A GOOD”) some good money today. (“GET”) That will help — (“I”)
D: Yeah. (“THE CHURCH” “WILL HELP” “DEFINITELY”)
A: . . . when Debbie gets back I was going to go. (TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: THE SOUNDS HEARD ON THE TAPE HERE ARE OF A ROLL OF PENNIES BEING DISPENSED INTO CASH REGISTER.)
(“OH WERE YOU” “OKAY” “REMEMBER WE” “BS” “MAYBE WE”)
A: If we have two people, (“MY”) I’m not going to be able to do it. (“WELL” “WH”)
E: When you both — (“COME BACK I WILL”)
Q: Pennies from (“NO” “BELL” “MMMMMMM” “LIKE A” “BY”) heaven.
E: I’ll just go.
A: Okay, well, Virginia go ahead and go.
E: Now?
A: Yes. And then I’ll go when Debbie gets back.
D: $1.68 is your change. (“UH”)
Q: Okay, thank you.
D: You’re welcome. (“PER DAY”)
Q: What is Darryl’s last name? (“WE CAN”)
A: Aarons.
Q: Oh, that’s a real biblical name. (“KILL” “MOM” “AIR” “GAY” “ALL”)
A: Dad sits in the front. (“HE’S MY”)
Q: You might be the reincarnation of Aaron or something. (“YEAH” “I NEED” “LOVE” “I”) Okay, thank you.
D: Thank you. (“AS I” “THAT WILL BE LIKE” “HATED” “SON” “AA” “UH HAY HUH” “FIG”)
Q: Thank you, Jimmy.
J: Thank you. Nice meeting you. (“MY”) Your name? (“MA”)
Q: Mark Russell Bell. (“I” “WHO OWN IT”)
J: Nice to meet you, Mark.
Q: My friends call me Mabus for short. (“UH-HUH”) Can I have an extra one of these to give to a friend?
P: (infant) Dad. (“NO”) Oww.
J: Sure.
Q: Okay. (“MAKE”) Why don’t you just give me a package? Thank you. (“UH-HUH” “TWO HUNDRED”)
( . . . )
Q: (speaking into tape recorder in car) I don’t know why I asked for extra brochures. I guess I was just trying to be polite. I don’t know. What do you say when you go to one of these things? (“AND”) People seem so hopeless. In terms of reaching them. Anyway, I gave him my channeled questions to God and two pictures of the Ark of the Covenant. So my envelope does have my name and address on it. So he can write me if he wants. If he has any questions. (“OR”) I hope I just made him think a little bit. I’ll be very happy if I made him think a little bit. So I wonder if Lovey-Boo thinks I did a good job. (“IF ALL”) If I ask that question and play this tape back later, will I hear a ‘yeessss.’ (“SSS”) Or a ‘no.’ Or a ‘I don’t care.’ By the way, one of the photos I gave him of the Ark of the Covenant was the one that I took with the press kit for “The Ten Commandments” spread out along the bottom with the stills and everything. I thought that would be a nice touch. (“AND”) I made two sets when I had the photos made. Sotheby’s sent them back to me. They’re not very good photos. They’re just Kodak instamatic throwaway camera photos. But I think he’ll get the point (“IF HE GE[TS]”) if he even has a chance to read it. I guess he gets a lot of strange things. (“SO”) He might not get everything if you know what I mean. That might be his associate’s job to go through it first or something. I don’t know. He must get a lot of hate mail (“AAA”) or something. I just remembered something else that really made me mad last week. I was reading — I think it was in the Los Angeles Times. (“BUT”) Apparently the people in Holland want nuclear power because the windmills are too loud. Excuse me? I mean here in L.A. we all live within hearing distance, practically, of the freeway. And you get used to it. It’s no big deal. You admire the nature around you. (“BUT”) Jesus Christ! If I was living in beautiful Amsterdam or Holland I wouldn’t complain about the windmills. Get a life. Who wants a big nuclear reactor to meltdown in your backyard?
( . . . )
Q: I have to remind myself that the truth is very powerful and sometimes I actually feel like, “Oh, wow. I can do this or I can do that. (“BECAUSE”) I have the truth on my side.” (“AND”) And I kind of know I’m destroying people’s lives by telling them the truth. Especially like that guy back there. But I’m not really doing that, am I? I’m really saving them. (“SO”) But I can’t really sort of get drunk with power so that’s why I’m talking right now. Just to let you know it is a real struggle. When you (“SSS”) think you know the truth — who doesn’t? — you want to share it and you want other people to react the way you want them to do. Of course, we have had problems in the past (“DISMISS”) listening to people like that — like Hitler and, well, you know. So, that’s why I like — something like my book (“THAT”) lets me talk when I’m in different moods at different times. After having such wonderful love and awareness come into my life. I’m sort of (“WOR” “RY A”) more aware. (“I GUESS”) I wonder if Mighael will (“TWO OF [TH]EM”) want me to go see that new John Travolta movie “Phenomenon.” It seems very similar in some ways to my own story. I don’t really want to see it. I don’t. Unless Mighael wants me to see it, I don’t want to see it.
( . . . )
Q: (chanting/singing on my way home) Oh Ya Boo!
( . . .)
(“SO I”)
Q: (back at condo) I see that Hank wrote in my book, “(Eph 4:11-16)” so I guess that means God channeling through him wants me to include that in my book. (“KKK”) So I will read those verses to you from the King James Bible. Mine was a Christmas gift from my grandmother on December 25th, 1963. It says, “Merry Christmas to Mark Russell with love from Grandmother, Aunt Esther, Aunt Dorothy and Cousin Mary.” (reading from Holy Bible) “And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: (“TTT”) From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.”
( . . . )
Q: Well, I just opened up The King James Only Controversy by James R. White and listen to this. It’s my sentiments exactly. On page 38:
Thousands and Thousands of Variants
You may hear someone speaking of the thousands ofvariants in the manuscripts of the Bible, and in one sense, theyare speaking the truth, as there are thousands of variants. One number that appears often in this context is 200,000 variants inthe New Testament alone! But just as it is wise to listen closelyto what a politician is saying, it is wise to look closely at thisclaim as well. If you put ten people in a room and asked themall to copy the first five chapters of the Gospel of John, you would end up with ten “different” copies of John. In other words, no two handwritten copies would be absolutely identical to each other. Someone would skip a word that everyone else has. One person would misspell that one wordthat they can never get right. Someone would probably skip aline, or even a verse, especially if there were similar words at the beginning or end of the verse before and the verse after. So you would end up with a lot of variants. But would you nothave ten copies of the same book? Yes, you would, and by comparing all ten copies you could rather easily reproduce the text of the original, because when one person makes a mistake,the other nine are not likely to do as the very same spot.
Q: Well, in any case my book is going to just have one version. It is not going to be edited by anyone other than myself. I’m just going to wait to find the publisher who will not make changes. And that will be the end of it. I’m not going to make the same mistakes that other messiahs or people who pretended to be messiahs. (“MADE”) I wish the Andersens would get here. They’re always late because of their responsibilities. (“BUT”) It sort of takes away from my computer time. I wonder if God is helping them get here. With the traffic and all that? (“TTT”) Where are they? Mighael, go get them and bring them here. (CUE)
