INTERVIEW — TAPE #65, SIDE #1
Q: Mark Russell BellH: Obadiah Harris, PRS PresidentT: Maya Thackerson, acquaintance at PRSD: DeVona Cox, acquaintance at PRSB: Barbara Crook, acquaintance at PRSU: unidentified PRS bookstore patronK: Kay Herron, acquaintance at PRSM: Maya Koyo, PRS bookstore managerL: Laura Leong, PRS bookstore staff memberK: Kerstan Carr, acquaintance at PRSC: Carolina Dejong, acquaintance at PRS
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: I TAPED OBADIAH HARRIS LEADING A MEDITATION FOR PHILOSOPHICAL RESEARCH SOCIETY PATRONS.)
H: . . . This then in the wisdom of the church. Start with one that is close to your own culture and then find a way to meditate day and night. In meditation, you think of a sacred square inch here in the forehead . . . If you get in a place where the light is not too bright and the chair is not too comfortable, if you’re not too full and you’re not too empty, and you’re not too sleepy and tired, and you’re not too aggressive and nervous, and you get calm — first, that calm and that quiet. You can start by just putting your feet on the floor and just be conscious of the fact that your feet (are) on the floor. There are many (“NO”) centers in your feet we didn’t talk about. That’s why Aurobindo talked about the feet. The roots go down. Ever try that? (“NO”) Try standing and being conscious of your feet so bending your knees just a little bit — that’s how a good voice teacher would teach you to really sing. Both feet flat and slightly bend your knees and be conscious of the fact that you’re on the floor. You’re on the ground. Doesn’t matter (I’m on) woo(d) platform and that’s cement (in auditorium) but underneath that’s the ground and I can feel it. (“C”) Conscious of your feet. I should probably do a demonstration like that — (let me) see who would like to come up here and stand on your feet and announce — say who you are. Do you want to hear one do that before we do this meditation? (“JA WOHL” “[U]M-H[UH]”) Okay, come up here. Don’t go anywhere. Both feet flat on the floor and say — just tell us who you are: “I am —”
M: I am Maya . . .
H: I want you to try that — as long as you sort of slightly bend your knees, feel the floor and say it. Tell us who you are.
T: I am Maya.
H: How did that feel?
H: It felt comfortable. Say it once more a little lou(der) so they’ll hear you in back.
T: I am Maya.
H: Yes, you are. (small laughter among audience) Please be conscious of your feet on the floor and who you are first. And of your calves and your legs, thighs . . . Be conscious of the space that you take up in this auditorium. And I want you to contemplate on the sacred inch in the forehead. Remember now, as you approach this, what is happening. You’re tuning in to that level of consciousness in yourself. You’re also tuning in to that consciousness in the universe. And that’s what Jacob Boehme was talking about — the holy movement. As you get at that level, you’re not only contact within yourself, you contact the universe so that anybody in the universe can contact you on that level. And that’s how the great mystics read the Akashic Record. Feel the sacred inch now. You can dim the lights if you want to. A little bit. I’d like to get you very quiet. I want you to experience something today. Atman. Sit with your spine as straight as you can. This keeps you very alert. Contemplate on the sacred inch. And now let us envision a tiny flame of light, a tiny fire. See it as you close your eyes. See that flame, that mystic fire right in the center of your forehead. And contemplate now with me its significance — what does it mean? This divine spark that is in you burning there. And in me. Symbol — the divine presence in the form of a higher mind. The formless taking on form as a form of your higher mind. And there is that flame. You know, in France the department of education is called the department of formation. That’s the role of education — to give form to the formless. So now you’re seeing one form of the formless. Tip of the flame in your forehead. Visualize it now. Hold it then. Just become conscious of its presence. Now I want you to feel the aspiration in your heart reaching up to that flame. Aurobindo says this is how transformation occurs — constant aspiration. It calls from below. And the supreme grace from below that ans(wers) — from above that answers. It’s not your aspiring to this flame — this special knowledge, this higher mind that leads directly to the oversoul that Emerson talked about, the new sphere that Taylor talked about, the rãtri paritakmya that the Vedãnta talks about, the holy movement that Boum talks about. All the same. The heart now is aspiring to this special flame, this special higher level of knowledge. It opens the door to the temple of wisdom — teachers helping more. Think of it as your access, how your heart aspires to that light. Now your aspiration’s touching that light and there’s a flicker. The vibration from the heart is nourishing that flame. There’s a sense of communion between those two centers. Now visualize with me—just visualize from the point of aspiration and visualization—this flame activating those two glands, pineal and pituitary. Visualize the mystic marriage. They’re being activated more so than ever before. Of the divine view that’s emerging from, spilling down into the Viuddha, the throat center — dynamizes your life and puts you in communion. Into the heart. . . . See the flicker of the flame. Visualize the activation of the glands . . . You have enough of love. You have enough of knowledge. You have enough compassion in your life. You don’t need any more. You just need to activate . . . No more disconnectedness, no more disparateness, no more antagonism. (“OF”) The opening of the third eye reconciles all apparent conflicts in your life . . . It is the great power of reconciliation where you see yourself as being reconciled. No more respond to ideas and notions that seem to disagree with you. You know that somewhere there’s a place of validity for that. So you’re free of arguments. You’re free of conflicts. You’re free of antagonism. The third eye makes you free so you begin to see more from the perspective of eternity. Every aspect of truth has its place . . . So what we do now is begin to say a few oms — a little chanting. At the same time — holding your vision of the light in the sacred square inch. I’ll say two or three oms and then you listen so you can tune in at the right pitch. We want the vibration to be just right and harmonious. Your soul will help you do that. It’s the harmonizing factor. It’s this right behind your heart. On the third om, join in. Let’s do about a dozen together, holding your vision of the light. Om. Om. All together now. Om. Om. Beautiful. Om. Louder still. Om. Again. Om. All together. Om. Om. Once more. Om. . . . the divine in you. Crowning glory. From the mountaintop. A few deep breaths. Exhale. Now may the peace of God that passes all understanding — peace that the world cannot give and cannot take away — triune peace of the infinite — peace within, peace without, peace transcendent abide in our hearts and minds now and forever. And all the people say “Amen.”
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: I BEGAN TRANSCRIBING HERE ON OCTOBER 5, 1999 AFTER WORKING ON TRANSCRIBING 1999 CASSETTES. I FIND IT DIFFICULT TO DIFFERENTIATE SPIRIT MESSAGES FROM BACKGROUND CONVERSATIONS AT THE PRS SO NOT ALL SPIRIT MESSAGES MAY BE INCLUDED IN THE TRANSCRIPT.)
Q: . . . book on the New Age and your last name — how do you spell it?
T: It’s Thackerson.
Q: Do you notice that your name ends the same way (that those of) a lot of very famous people do right now: Magic Johnson, O.J. Simpson, Michael Jackson. It’s almost like all these people — and your name is ‘son’ — (“WW”) what do you think of that?
T: I’ve always been fascinated by names. (“G”) My real name that I was given was Huupponen which ends with ‘nen.’ I kept my married name Thackerson.
Q: And how do you spell that?
T: (spells) (“UM-HUH”)
Q: And what does that mean?
T: That means ‘the hope of life.’ (“THEY KILL”)
Q: I see. (“SO”) Don’t you find that there are a lot of very spiritual people that come here every week?
T: Yes, I’ve been coming here for twenty-five years.
Q: Um-huh. I don’t know — all this ‘son son son’ everywhere. It’s almost like — you know, the new millennium is almost like (“IT’S”) foreshadowing the coming of the Son of Man. (“DO YOU THINK”)
T: Um-huh. That could well be. (“YEAH”) It could be a strong connection.
Q: Thank you.
T: My pleasure. Kiittää.
Q: Yes — oh what does that mean?
T: Kiittää means thank you in Finnish. (“K”)
Q: Thank you.
( . . . )
Q: It’s so funny. Jacob. (“AN”) Jacob Boehme and Jonah. How do you spell Boehme’s last name?
Q: You know, it’s so funny. God really should have chose — have you written any books?
Q: What are they?
H: They’re in the bookstore.
Q: An(d) — (“ARE THEY”) have you ever — did you write one in particular that goes into all these various people you’ve been talking about?
H: Well they’re alluded to in The New Consciousness — that book called The New Consciousness.
Q: Okay, fine.
D: You were marvelous this morning. I really enjoyed it.
Q: Oh hi. Remember me?
D: Of course I do. We looked into each other’s eyes.
D: Certainly. (I) never forget anybody.
Q: I transcribed the interview, basically, last night and my Angel Who speaks into my tape recorder told me that the spelling of his name was like “BOUTIQUE”: O — U — T — I. So He’s helping me with the spelling even.
D: I’ll be darned. (“YEAH”) (laughs) That’s wonderful.
Q: Isn’t that great? And what is your husband’s name?
D: Duane Cox.
Q: Right. Duane. By the way, Obadiah, can I use your meditation in my book that I’m doing?
H: Sure. I think that’s a good one.
Q: The fact that God chose me to write this book — (“I MEAN I”) I really think He should’ve chosen someone like you. While you were doing all this research —
H: God knows what He’s doing.
Q: — I was watching movies.
H: God knows what He’s doing.
Q: Okay, thank you.
( . . . )
Q: You should write a book like the one — like the lecture. (“EITHER”) You should put your lectures together in a book —
Q: Or you should write a book about each one of — that would summarize —
H: Each of those great characters.
H: Oh well that’s a good suggestion.
Q: Because I have (“VARI”) problems spelling all these various people because I have not read the book.
Q: Could you spell really quick some of them for me?
H: Well let’s see. There was Teilhard de Chardin. (“T”)
Q: That’s easy.
H: You know. And there was Boehme. (spells each) There was Spinoza.
H: Well we talked about so many.
Q: Well, of course, the one that was most like me was the cobbler.
H: Oh yes. Well he couldn’t read or write. You’re better off than that.
Q: Well just barely.
( . . . )
Q: What’s your name?
B: My name is Barbara Crook and I had an extensive astrological reading two years ago. I was very upset because my husband had died and my daughter is alienated from me. And so she did a long — it took her several days and then we went through it all day long — and went through the reading. And what she told me — I was an old soul. I had been a spiritual leader in another life and I needed to find some spiritual basis for this one. I don’t remember a lot of other details except they were about what was going to happen to me in this life which (or “WHICH” or “WITCH” “AA”) are rather interesting.
Q: Basically, (“WHAT”) in one line or two what did she say?
B: Well —
Q: That would happen to you?
B: What would happen to me? That I would be married three times. I’ve only been married once. That husband died. The second marriage would last not too long — I’ve been going with this fellow for six years — but he would be killed very suddenly. And then I’d have a third marriage and I’m afraid to marry my man.
B: I’m very frightened of marrying him.
Q: Maybe she meant you were married (“BY”) to God and to Jesus or something.
B: Maybe so. (“NO”)
Q: Let’s look at it that way.
B: Let’s look at it that way. (“AND”)
Q: And, let’s see, what else? Oh — what was your maiden name?
Q: And what is — did you know any symbolic meaning for that or anything?
B: The word — it’s either a Dutch or a German name and I don’t know what it means. I really don’t know. (“WHEN MY”)
Q: My book (can) come out and then people can figure out. (“WHAT THEY MEAN”)
Q: I can’t do it all myself.
B: (laughs) Okay.
Q: Nice meeting you.
B: You’re very welcome.
( . . . )
Q: Did you notice that strange hum when she asked that? (“ONE”) There was a strange hum in the room when you asked (“WHEN”) what year he died.
U: The air conditioning went ummpf.
Q: I don’t know what it was.
U: I think it was because I notice it disappeared and then all of a sudden it started. (“UH-HUH”)
K: Okay. You’ve got a card. She’ll put that on for you.
Q: I couldn’t tell how much this was.
K: Well it’s free if it doesn’t have a price on it.
Q: This is my lucky day. I notice you have Gustav Davidson’s book A Dictionary of Angels. That’s a beautiful book. And, also, have you been selling Joseph Campbell recently? A lot of his books?
M: Not a lot.
Q: They have interesting names with ‘bell’ and ‘son.’ That’s what my book is about. What was your name again?
Q: Maya. That’s right. And that’s M — A — (“I”) Y — A? . . . Okay, thank you.
( . . . )
Q: What’s your name?
Q: Last name?
Q: What does that mean?
L: I don’t know.
Q: You don’t know what it means. (“OKAY”)
L: No, I don’t. It’s like Smith in China.
Q: Really. I’m sure it has some meaning.
Q: Especially since you work here.
L: (small laugh) I’m sure it does. What’s your name?
Q: Well my author’s pseudonym is Mark Russell Bell.
L: Mark Russell Bell.
Q: So —
L: Your pen name. Is that what you call it?
Q: Yes. (“I”) My pen name. My real name is Mark Gordon Russell. And my mother’s maiden name was King. (“SO”)
L: You have names coming out . . .
Q: I used to be worried that my name Mark Russell Bell was an anagram for ‘Mabus.’ I don’t think so anymore. So I don’t have to worry about that. (“YEAH”)
( . . . )
Q: . . . I really tell you people when you talk on the phone that the next person who might be calling might be a god in forming. (“HE SAID THAT HE HAD”) Did he say that to you? (“OH”) He said that at a staff meeting today. He didn’t think people in the bookstore were worthy (to attend)?
L: (laughs) That’s great.
Q: I mean everyone’s a little bit of a bullshit artist. Even Obadiah.
( . . . )
Q: You should talk to him and say that, “We’re staff members too. We should go to the staff meetings.” Right?
L: We were invited — aren’t we?
M: Yes, we are.
Q: But you just didn’t go, right?
M: Well, maybe . . . missed that particular — (“ONE” “WELL”)
Q: Okay. Well he’s going to read about this in my book and be awfully embarrassed.
( . . . )
Q: Oh my goodness. I noticed you also have Queen of the Sun by E. J. Michael. (“DO I”)
( . . . )
Q: Maya, this looks perfect for my book. (“NO”) These ten (“CO”) codes for humanity. Do you know where this came from?
M: No, I don’t.
Q: Isn’t that interesting? It’s got a beautiful little heart. It’s from The Creative Group. (“I”) This is (“LIKE”) fate (“DECREE”) that I find this — (“N”) say this into my book. So thank you. I don’t need a bag.
M: You don’t?
Q: No. Okay. See you next week.
( . . . )
Q: I just met two ladies here. I’m writing a book on the New Age which encompasses reincarnation. But I’ve been finding — I’ve been meeting people who’ve come up to me and told me who they’re the reincarnations of. (“AND”) In most cases, they look exactly like the person they’re the reincarnation of. For example, my therapist told me he’s the reincarnation of Richard III and apparently he looks just like Richard III. My pseudonym is Mark Russell Bell and I found an Egyptian medallion of Bel-Marduk and I look exactly like him.
K: Oh really?
Q: So this is suggesting to me that reincarnation is true.
C: Yes. Yeah, well it seems I had read — I was telling her I read a few books about reincarnation. And one of them — have you experienced regression? You know when you go to a therapist doctor to know about your past lives?
Q: Past life regression.
C: Okay. There was a case in England about a lady who went with her husband to this meeting because — I don’t remember the details why she was having some problems. Usually people who want to — (“YOU”) you can see my English is not that good.
Q: What’s your name real quick?
C: Carolina. And yours?
C: Mark. (“WHILE”)
Q: Last name too?
C: Dejong. (“N”)
Q: Spell the first name.
C: (spells) (“NO”)
Q: You have a beautiful medallion of Christ.
C: Oh yes. This sacrado corazon — the sacred heart. (“ART”)
Q: Of Jesus. (“C I”) Okay well finish your story.
C: Okay, what happened to this lady. She was in regression but the psychiatrist doctor was so scared because she went back so — I think to the 18 — 1400 century or something like that and then — there was this woman in England who had an allergic problem. What happened is when she was talking to the doctor because that’s who she was in the 1400 — this lady. That wasn’t the psychiatrist doctor. And then she said “the napkin” — I mean not the napkin. The handkerchief. “I need a handkerchief.” And she woke up before the doctor made her wake. The doctor said that was the worst experience. He was terrified because, you know, she could’ve remained there. Like in the 1400. Taken that personality, you know?
C: And she was telling her husband — in the 1400s, “Where was the handkerchief made of a certain material?” Because he passed her a kleenex at the doctor’s office. She didn’t want the kleenex. And then she woke up and looked at the doctor. And they were terrified. And this long story. The doctor brought her back to the present time and awoke her.
Q: There was a French woman named Catherine Cadiere who once saw the face of Jesus on a handkerchief or napkin or something. And I found out that this is another person who I might be the reincarnation of. (“SO”) I mean so apparently — the three people I know about are Bel-Marduk, Catherine Cadiere and a woman by the name of Julia Pastrana. So apparently it surpasses gender, religion — everything.
C: But this also has to do with karma, right?
C: Okay. But to me it — (“SOUNDS”) unfair that you have to pay for one mistake you made in your life because this is what is called cause and effect. Right? You cause something and the effect of what you have caused.
Q: Well I think I’ve had lots of really good lives. (“SO THIS”) This lifetime I’m supposed to really work diligently on this book for mankind and for other people unselfishly. (“BECAUSE”) I’ve been very busy recently. So it’s not all fun and parties for me. It’s hard work.
K: What are you doing then?
Q: I’m writing a New Age bible. (“OH”) So what’s your name, by the way?
K: My name is Kerstan.
Q: Kerstan? As in that little actress who was in the vampire movie?