INTERVIEW — TAPE #58, SIDE #2
Q: Mark Russell BellI: Marie Todd, friend
Q: Okay. So Marie is here. Just to give Marie an update, today I was at the Southern California HIV/AIDS Hotline and we started talking about Stockholm Syndrome. (“WHICH”)
I: What’s that?
Q: Well, it has to do with kidnappers and their hostages — (“WELL WHAT”) we saw in the movie “12 Monkeys” basically.
I: Oh, how fearful.
Q: Exactly. So I just reminded them — (“WELL”) I said, “Well, in my case, it’s a lot more like the movie ‘Ruthless People.'”
I: (laughs) That’s funny.
Q: Exactly. But I didn’t go into the bloody details. (“ALSO I”) I was reading (“SOME OF THE”) the Bhagavad-Gita and just to prove that holy books (“ARE”) are funny — I think that they’re more funny than anything else.
Q: Because one of the early stories in the Bhagavad-Gita concerns — I mean that’s the one thing I don’t like about the Holy Bible is that it’s very hard to find humorous things unless you see the whole thing as just one big humorous thing. How do you see it?
Q: Very intense. “Dry” and intense — as my friend Paul once said. (I read the following.)
The brothers took Draupadi back to the forest, where Kunti was awaiting them. “Mother,” they cried, “we have brought home a wonderful treasure!” “Be sure to share it equally, my children,” Kunti answered; then she saw the girl, and exclaimed in dismay: “Oh, what have I said!” But it was too late. Her word was sacred to her sons. So Draupadi married all the brothers together.
Q: Now isn’t that something that’s a little bit more funny than what you read in the Old and New Testament? I mean life is funny. Let’s face it.
I: You have to look at it humorously. That’s the only way. (“RIGHT SO”)
Q: So anything else new with you? (“YOU MENTIONED THAT”) I showed her (“O[F]”) the Holy Grail and she was reminded of the movie “Excalibur.”
I: Yes. I love “Excalibur.” It’s one of my favorite movies. Everybody should have a Merlin. (small laugh)
Q: Exactly. And we have Timothy as our Merlin. (“AND UM”) It’s funny. (“FI”) My friend Fiona once ran into Helen Mirren at the Beverly Center.
I: (gasps) When?
Q: I don’t know. A few years ago. But it’s just ironic because I guess Fiona’s very close to the energy of Morgana le Fay and Helen Mirren played that role in “Excalibur.”
I: How poetic. (“SO”)
Q: That’s enough (“TA”) taping for today. I already have too many tapes.
I: I want to see the photographs.
( . . . )
Q: So Marie and I are back from having dinner at Barragan’s. During dinner we had an interesting conversation and I realized that the word son is in Mel Gibson’s name and that the only acceptance speech at the Golden Globes that I heard before the TV clicked off was the one that Cybill Shepherd gave and her name also has very symbolic meanings. And Marie is reading over (the rough draft of) her interviews in the book so I want to get her candid response to her interviews.
I: They’re funny.
Q: They are funny. I think they’re funny too.
I: Well, I would hope so. (“I WOULD”) I think I have a sense of humor about life.
Q: And now, just because nobody would ever believe me, you can verify some of the strange things that have been happening tonight.
I: Um-huh. (pause)
Q: To give you a hint, when we left what happened?
I: The gates in the parking lot opened.
Q: And I didn’t have my gate opener with me.
Q: And there was no one there.
I: No. It was really weird.
Q: And then outside — to the best of your recollection — try to paraphrase what that weird lady was saying to us. There was this black woman who (“DIDN[‘T]”) needed money so I gave her a dollar and told her about the 800 Interfaith number for community services. (“I”)
I: When we were on our way into the restaurant.
Q: What did she say? To the best of your recollection?
I: She was going on something about the Bible and the aliens and the movie studios and — (“SHE SAID THE”)
Q: The Bible was a movie.
I: Yeah. That the Bible was a movie and that, “Oh, come this way, angels. This is where the door is.”
Q: She showed us the door.
I: Because we went to the wrong door.
Q: To the wrong door.
I: (small laugh) (“AND”)
Q: When she was telling us this, I said, “Well, yes, I’m Jesus and this is Mary.” And she became very emotional for a moment. Most people would definitely think that she was one of the ‘nutzos’ but I think she’s (“JUST”) in her own separate reality, which is a word that really makes Mighael blanch. (“UM-HUH” “BUT”)
I: We know that. (“RIGHT”) From your interviews.
Q: Right. (“BUT I MEAN”) People would think this woman was mentally ill but who is to judge? She’s fine. I asked her (“IF SHE”) if she had someplace to stay and she said, yes, she did have a home. So she wasn’t homeless, at least. So that’s good. I don’t know.
I: I guess (“YOU KNOW”) perhaps she was a street philosopher. That’s what she appeared to be.
Q: And I’m so used to getting these kinds of messages from people. (“BUT”) This is, like, the first time that Marie, I guess, actually —
I: I had never participated in that before. (“SO IT WAS”) A little alarming. (small laugh)
Q: I guess people just, again, are nervous around things they don’t understand and comprehend — whereas, at this point, I just don’t even try anymore.
I: I just thought of all the subject matter she had to babble about, that’s what she zoomed in on. And I just like —
Q: And it crossed over nicely to my project.
I: I just froze for a moment. I was speechless.
Q: Exactly. (“IT’S LIKE”) ‘Oh my God, here’s somebody else (“WHO’S”) thinking on the same wavelength as Mark is yet how could that be?’ (“I DON’T KNOW”)
I: I don’t know. (“I MEAN EVEN THE”)
Q: Even the alien connection.
I: Oh, then she started going on about the aliens.
Q: And angels. And Bible. And movies. And studios.
I: And so they’re all connected.
Q: We’ll have to wait and see how.
I: I guess. (“ELSE”)
Q: Anything else you want to add? I’m trying to think. I guess that was all that we witnessed for today.
Q: That’s enough. Except I guess I should point out that you’re again wearing your —
I: Oh, don’t give me a bad wardrobe report.
Q: No no —
I: End of story.
Q: — your necklace and —
Q: Well, see? But you don’t understand. It’s not a matter of good or bad. (“UH”) I’m just saying that she’s wearing her pyramid, um, T-shirt again and it’s because subconsciously she selected this to wear without realizing that it was the same thing she wore last time. But do you understand —
I: Well, I wasn’t planning on a wardrobe report. It’s just what I put on this morning. (laughs) (“BUT THAT”)
Q: But, see, that’s the whole point. (“DO YOU UNDERST[AND] — DO”) She’s also wearing a very beautiful snake pin and I kidded with her. I said, “Well, don’t you feel a little nervous wearing that kind of a symbol?” And she said —
I: “No. It’s a conversation piece.”
Q: And I said, “Exactly.”
I: Even when it upsets people it makes people respond to it and then they end up getting over themselves because everything doesn’t have that deep meaning. It’s just a pin. (“OKAY”)
Q: And now I’m going to have Marie read the letter the fax I sent to Sherry and Brad Kessell’s letter. Well, first she’s going to read Brad Kessell’s letter and you can hear her probably laugh in the background.
I: (small laugh) “Inappropriate” behavior.
Q: Isn’t that the understatement of the year? I love it how we’re on a first name basis. “Unfortunately, Mark . . .”
I: Do you know him?
Q: Of course not.
Q: But the funny thing is that this was delivered at nine o’clock at night. There was a message on my machine. I was taking a rest at that time, I guess, that they called (from the front security gate). I didn’t hear the phone ring. Maybe it didn’t ring. (“BUT” “IT’S JUST”) It’s just strange to have a delivery that late at night.
I: Well, wait. What are the appropriate channels? I don’t understand.
Q: I guess a literary agent or attorney.
I: I would “submit it . . . through appropriate channels.” I don’t know what an appropriate channel is.
Q: I guess he means dropping it off on her desk (“IN”) at nighttime is not an appropriate channel.
I: Well, what is? That’s vague.
Q: Yes, really. (“BUT HE DI”) But notice that he —
I: I’m not saying (“YEAH”) how it should be done. I just don’t know what that means. I’m an idiot.
Q: And, by the way, just for the record (“WHEN”) when we were at the screening for “Money Plays” Marie told me please not to write those comments on it. In fact, she was horrified. In fact — (“WHEN WE WENT”)
I: It freaked me out bad. And I knew I had to deal with it. (small laugh) (“IT’S LIKE”)
Q: ‘You’re not really going to hand this in, are you?’ Isn’t that what you thought?
I: I was just horrified, sitting there watching you write. I was like, ‘I know this person!’ (gasps) You put me on the verge of a panic attack.
Q: Yeah. Oh well. We’ll have to — (“WHEN”)
I: Who cares?
Q: Exactly. (“AS”) As long as you’re having fun. (“AND NOT HA[RMING]”) And not hurting anyone else. Right?
Q: So, anyway, we’ll see what — what response do you think this fax is going to get? I mean it’s just very nice and to the point. (“I THINK”)
I: (pauses as she reads it) Well, it’s brief and to the point. I don’t know what’s underneath it, though.
Q: That was my original letter that I sent to her.
I: Oh, okay.
( . . . )
I: When we walked in after dinner, my pager started going wacko and it wasn’t just doing the normal beep beep beep low battery — when the battery is dead. All the numbers came up and it cleared itself like it does if you turn it off and turn it on.
I: Yes. (“WELL SEE THESE ARE”)
Q: These little things are always happening. I just wonder (might these be considered as — or if/and/) when the big things are going to start happening. (“D[O]”) Do you ever wonder about that?
I: No, I don’t. I can’t deal with that right now. (“OKAY”)
Q: Well, you were the one who said, “Well, you know, the millennium is coming to an end.” (“WA[S]”) Wasn’t that you saying that?
I: Well, no, I didn’t say it was coming to an end. I was just saying that’s like the whole big thing now that everybody’s looking forward to. Whatever that means.
Q: Well? Here I am. Here is Son of Man. Ready — unfortunately. It’s like — we were talking too — I must say it is very humbling for both of us because interacting with this woman tonight — (“I MEAN”) I sincerely believe that God is in each one of us so there’s no way we can ever feel like we’re on some kind of ego trip just because we happen to be the metaphor or symbol for Jesus and Mary at this time and place.
I: Maybe you but I don’t think that’s me.
Q: No, I know but we’re just — it’s metaphoric. But we don’t feel like that makes us some kind of celebrity or anything. It just makes us feel like —
I: Well, I’m far from a celebrity.
Q: Right. It just makes us feel like we have that much more (“RESPO”) of a responsibility to share with people since we have been sort of chosen as spokespeople of a kind for the usual Godly messages of truthfulness — (“N”)
I: Oh, that’s a little sappy, Mark. (“WELL” “SO WHAT ARE YOU”)
Q: What are you the spokesperson for?
I: I don’t have anything else to say.
Q: Okay. Neither do I. What else is new? (“BUT”) Anyway, my book speaks for itself, right?
I: That’s right.
Q: The entire book speaks for itself. That’s all we have to say.
I: There you go.
( . . . )
Q: (speaking into tape recorder) There’s two particularly horrendous stories in the Friday, January 26th issue of the Los Angeles Times. “Column One” presents “Stung by a Nuclear Sting” by Mary Williams Walsh, Times staff writer. (“BBB”)
What Germany billed as the world’s largest seizure of smuggled plutonium has blown up in officials’ faces. Critics say agents imperiled the public and failed to catch the culprits.
Q: And then, on page A3, there’s an article entitled “Surgery to Separate Siamese Twins Planned” by Tony Perry, Times staff writer. Well, this is a very serious mistake. If only one girl has only a slim chance of surviving, this is murder. How soon they forget ‘Let no man cut asunder what God hath joined together.’ Being a twin, I’ve watched other Siamese twins on television over the years and I even once saw some children who were joined at the head when I was covering an interview while working at Slade, Grant, Hartman & Hartman. They’re fine. They love each other. This is the way they were born. They know they’re different but they’re happy with their life. They find ways of living. The only thing that’s sad is what other people project into them and how they alienate them because they feel uncomfortable being around them. Well, being a twin, I never have felt uncomfortable being around Siamese twins. I have compassion for them, knowing how difficult life can be when you have some kind of disability but, certainly, nothing can excuse this murder. Although a theme of my book is not to be judgmental, I don’t really feel like I’m being judgmental in stating an obvious truth. My impression is that doctors and lawyers are especially in jeopardy of either damnation or not having eternal life for the obvious reasons and Mighael just touched my hair so I don’t know what that means. (“I JUST”) I don’t know if I’m speaking for Him or just speaking for myself but I think that’s another obvious truth. That’s another one of the themes of my books.
Medicine: Operation is set for Saturday in San Diego. One girl has only slim chance of surviving, doctors say.
Q: It’s sad.
( . . . )
Q: So it’s Friday night 9:52 and I want to record my thoughts for the day. I realize I could say anything right now. Anything. And it would be (“AN”) important due to my experience. I could say something political — (“BUT”) I don’t really feel compelled to do that at that moment. I just (“CO[M]”) compelled to record my truth. I don’t care about influencing other people. I do care about the suffering in the world but I feel that just doing a very honest book will be the most helpful thing that I can do because my experiences, I feel, have given me a very clear picture of reality — our shared reality. And today my interaction with my Deity was such that I felt loved all day and the only phenomena I can express happened when I was transcribing. At the end of tape #48, side #1, I was basically transcribing that I didn’t want to give myself too much work to do and then after spellchecking the file the word “myself” appeared at the very end and I knew that I had not done that by mistake. He just wanted to remind everyone through me — (“AND I KEEP”) see, when I say “give myself too much work to do,” (“I MEAN”) again Mighael is channeling this book through me. This is why (“YOU CAN SEE IN”) throughout the tapes He’ll say something and then I’ll say something so He’s definitely giving me the voice. (“THI[S]”) This is how He (K) works through each of us. We’re each an expression of Him. I can’t, myself, comprehend that kind of Creativity that could be overseeing everything — (“EE” “YOU KNOW IN” “EVERYONE’S”) every person’s life on Earth and then on other worlds and in other dimensions and throughout universes all at the same time. (“I MEAN HE’S” “IT’S JUST”) It’s just impossible for anyone to comprehend. And yet He still wants credit. I almost wonder too (“I MEAN”) when He wrote “myself” on the monitor — I wonder if He (“DID THAT”) did that with a little bit of humor. I certainly wouldn’t want people to get the impression — (“LIKE”) it reminded me of last Sunday when Gay Luce was talking about Sai Baba and giving him credit for God’s miracles. It’s so easy just to say ‘he did this’ or ‘I did this’ or (“HUM”) ‘give myself too much work to do.’ We have to keep remembering it all starts with God. Every creative expression is His claim and we are the ones who are blessed by it. So, again, I’m making (“THAT”) this point and this is why we have such a great relationship. At least, I hope. Today, I ran into my ex-physical trainer at the gym and he was very nice and polite. He said I looked great. He always smiles when he sees me. And I just happened to be reading The Complete Prophecies of Nostradamus that I received a few days ago. The Millennium Edition translated, edited and interpreted by Henry C. Roberts; updated by Robert Lawrence. So I find that very interesting. And I’m also thinking about the Bhagavad-Gita because, again, my perception of reality is such that I can see the truth in whatever source I look at. So when I saw Doug, I looked at the picture of Nostradamus in the book that was a portrait “painted from life by his son Caesar.” (“AND”) Doug did look somewhat like that. He felt maybe the nose was a little off but I was reminded last Sunday when somebody compared me to the god (Amun-)Ra — she said my nose was a little bit off even though, frankly, I couldn’t tell. And I’ve been looking at myself in the mirror for ages and it looks just like me. But, anyway, (“HE HAD”) again, he had a moustache just like Nostradamus and the high forehead. Now the author of this book — the late author Henry C. Roberts was alive while Doug was alive and he always felt that he was somehow maybe the reincarnation of Nostradamus. (“BUT I”) I think maybe it’s closer to him actually channeling Nostradamus. The word Robert Lawrence used was redivivus and it’s something to think about. So, in looking at the book, I was struck by the preface to the first edition, which was “A Letter of Dedication to his son, Caesar Nostradamus.” Notradamus wrote, “The prophets, by means only of the immortal God and good Angels, have received the spirit of vaticination, by which they foresee things, and foretell future events.” Well, this is the same as my case and, again, it struck me how honest and straightforward he was being in terms of mentioning God and angels. Just like myself. But usually when one thinks of Nostradamus one doesn’t think of God or angels necessarily. And yet they are definitely just as strong a part of his work as mine: “The reason is evident why what he foretelleth comes by divine inspiration, or by the means of an angelical spirit, inspired into the prophetic person . . .” Again, this sounds very familiar to me. Near the end of the preface, Nostradamus writes, “Sed quando submoventa erit ignorantia” (“When the time arrives for the removal of ignorance”). This was written “From Salon, this 1st of March, 1555.” Well, my book is definitely the time for the removal of ignorance. I’ve just looked through Century I so far and the quatrains that struck me (“WELL”) was beginning with the first one. Nostradamus wrote — according to this translation:
Seated at night in my secret study,
Alone, reposing over the brass tripod,
A slender flame leaps out of the solitude,
Making me pronounce that which is not in vain.
Q: Well, that almost brings to mind somebody watching a film. It almost sounds like somebody in a theatre with a film being projected onto a screen. So that’s interesting. The author wrote, “Nostradamus clearly shows his method of preparing for a nocturnal visitation from divine sources, from which he shall gain the knowledge of future events for the benefit of Posterity.” The next one that struck me was quatrain 25. (car alarm begins in background)
Lost, found again, hidden so great a while,
A Pasteur as Demi-God shall be honored,
But before the moon her great cycle ends,
By other ancient ones shall be dishonored.
Q: The author writes: “Louis Pasteur, the great French physician, is shown here to be worshiped almost as a Demi-god for his discoveries, until a resurgence of an older school.” Well, I guess this book as that resurgence of the older school because (“THE”) the whole series of medical discoveries that began with Pasteur I’m definitely debunking in my book. I do believe that there is some good there. (“BUT”) In my own experience, it has been (“IT HAS BEEN VERY LIMITED”) of limited use to me.
(TRANSCRIBER’S NOTE: SOME UNTRANSCRIBED NOTES FROM A PRS LECTURE [TO BE ADDED IN THE FUTURE] WILL PRESENT EVIDENCE THAT THE PLACEBO EFFECT HAS ALWAYS BEEN THE MOST EFFECTIVE TREATMENT OF DISEASE. OFTEN THE BODY’S OWN HEALING ABILITIES ARE OVERLOOKED AS INDIVIDUALS ATTRIBUTE THEIR RECUPERATION SOLELY TO THEIR PRESCRIPTIONS.)
Q: Antibiotics, I think, may or may not have helped me. I mean how can you really tell if something is helping you? Maybe it’s just your body doing it anyway. (“AND”) It’s something for people to think about. Especially since antibiotics are not working anymore because of the superstrains.
( . . . )
Q: Next, in quatrain 50, the translation reads:
From the aquatic triplicity shall be born,
One who shall make Thursday his holiday,
His fame, praise, rule, and power shall grow,
By Land and Sea to become a tempest to the east.
Q: This was interpreted, “Notradamus predicts the origin of the United States 200 years before it existed. The ‘aquatic triplicity’ refers to the Atlantic, the Pacific, and the Gulf of Mexico. Also the national holiday of Thanksgiving, always on Thursday (Thor) is noted.” Well, this doesn’t really sound correct to me. The aquatic triplicity is ‘a big stretch’ as my shrink used to say. I think it stands instead for the trinity, which is usually depicted in the sign of three fishes. And, of course, I am the ‘Son’ in our New Age metaphor. Mighael is ‘the Holy Ghost.’ And God is the ‘Father.’ (“AND SO”) From this aquatic triplicity — (“WELL YOU KNOW HOW I’VE”) I’ve been going back and forth (“ABOUT”) which day would be the best day for people to do their — (“LIKE”) hold their church service. I used to think it would be Monday but then I thought it would be better on Tuesday but I still think it’s too early in the week. I really am beginning to think that Thursday is the best day for people to have church because it’s late in the week. People are winding down. Hopefully, on the weekend they’ll be doing things to help mankind instead of going to church so I definitely think that Thursday is the right day. Thursday. Definitely Thursday. Church services should be held on Thursday. So as my fame and praise and rule and power shall grow in terms of just giving light to common sense truths about God, certainly my book will become a tempest to the Eastern religions even though — well, I’ll talk about that more when I talk about the Bhagavad-Gita. In quatrain 53, the translation reads:
Alas, how a great people shall be tormented
And the Holy Laws in total ruin,
By other laws, all Christianity troubled,
When new mines of gold and silver will be found.
Q: Well, again, I think this has to do more with me than “The industrial revolution, the discovery of gold mines in Africa, Australia, etc., the rise of the God of Mammon, shall bring grief to all of Christendom.” This is the author’s interpretation: “Predicts the suffering of the American Indians under the greedy hands of the white man and their struggle to maintain their customs and spirituality.” No, I think that this has to do with my book. I know I’m very vain just like in that song “You’re So Vain” — “You probably think this song is about you . . .” (“YES”) Unfortunately, I do. Based on my concept of the subconscious mind, I even think that the letter that begins this book is sort of like a secret letter to me. So Nostradamus thought he was writing it to his son, Caesar, but it really was God writing the letter to me.