Q: Mark Russell Bell
J: Jack Landman, host of “Cybercity Radio”
K: Kris Zebrowski, co-producer of “Cybercity Radio” Internet show
(X): (unattributed sounds occasionally noted)

J: Okay, I’m coming back. I don’t know. We have gremlins here tonight. Mark, are you with us?

Q: Yes, I am.


J: Okay, now do you think Michael or any of the other entities you know could be accounting for — we’re just having haywire equipment issues here tonight.

Q: I don’t —

J: What do you think?

Q: I — I don’t — (“YOU”) it’s a pretty loving Entity. It — I — I —

J: Okay.

Q: I — I don’t blame negative things on — on Mighael.

J: Okay. Well maybe a something — (“R”) someone else then because we are having just the strangest batch of weird equipment problems.

Q: Like what, for example?

J: Oh we — we — we lost the complete signal for a few moments earlier and we’ve got our CD player skipping and we’ve got our Email won’t operate properly so it’s just a bunch — yeah, that’s also going on. So, folks, I don’t know what it is out there. It just may be one of those nights. Equipment sometimes does that but —

Q: Well it might be the Email. Maybe Mighael doesn’t think people have heard enough really to comment yet.

J: (laughs) So, okay, well we’ll take that as a — as a possibility. So, you know, we’ve been kind of all over the place.

Q: Let me — I think I should express the key paragraph in my news release — release, basically.

J: Yes.

Q: And that’s where it says:

He comments, “After my trip, the range of my experiences throughout my life enabled me to find parallels between the account of the Angelic Force called ‘Michael’ by the family in Oklahoma with what has been recorded about the Angel Who spoke to Moses in the Mount, was mentioned as an ‘angelical spirit’ in the Nostradamus 1555 letter to his son, used Edgar Cayce as a channel, was referred to as ‘The Mahatmas’ by THE SECRET DOCTRINE author Madame Blavatsky, communicated via the Ouija Board to inspire the MESSAGES FROM MICHAEL books, and was glimpsed in a near death experience by Dr. George Ritchie as described in his book RETURN FROM TOMORROW.”

J: Um-huh.

Q: So that seems to be the — the major message that I — that is my purpose to bring is to show that the original Jesus was just a Christed one by this Son of God/Christ Force.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And I — I even think — I think that paragraph really puts — puts it in (X) — into perspective.

J: Would you say in — that that’s kind of — (“O[NE]”) one of your ultimate messages is what you just explained to us about your view on Jesus Christ?

Q: Yes. Yes. In fact, today — just to give you an idea of the synchronicity and the Love that I receive. Outside — I was going to Sav-On to get some dietary supplements for my mother —

J: Um-huh.

Q: — and the car parked right out in front said “I — heart sign —” — because in California we have these hearts that are used in — in the licenses.

J: Um-huh. (“IT”)

Q: It said, “I — heart sign — JESUS” right outside of Sav-on.

J: Um-huh.

Q: So that’s pretty much what I’m accustomed to experiencing. I must say that sometimes when I’m not in a good mood and (X) I have to vent at someone — I do tend to see bumper stickers that have different themes such as “putting the fun back into dysfunction.”

J: (laughs) Let — let me get you to tell us a little bit about the way the website flows so our listeners, you know, can really dig into the detail and, as you say, you presented things in a completely documentary fashion. But if — if we go to your website at testament dot org and we enter the area called Testament as opposed to New Testament we — we get into a website that has oh maybe a dozen or so sub-areas in it, including your “Publishing Information,” of course. But we do get into real content related to the things you’re talking about with a section called “Feature Story About Testament Submitted . . .,” “Excerpts,” “Introduction,” “Testament Preface,” “Fortean Times Magazine Article,” “Interview Participants,” “Testament — Special Internet Edition,” “Photos and Captions,” etc. What — tell us about the — that flow of the website in — and what you’re presenting and why you’re presenting it as you are.

Q: Well when I published the paperback first edition of the book, I didn’t want it to be spirituality for sale. In fact, my contract with the Oklahoma family specifies that they’ll get all the profits from the book, if any.

J: Um-huh.

Q: So far, there have not been any . . .

J: They —

Q: It i(s) —

J: By the way, as an aside and I’m sorry — throw you of course for a second.

Q: Yeah?

J: Do they expect to or hope to make money from their experiences?

Q: Well I had an Email from Twyla a couple weeks ago and she’s got more kids now. She was talking about divorce and I said she can’t even think about divorce with all those kids.

J: Uh-huh.

Q: She obviously (X) is in desperate need of money.

J: Right.

Q: And she knows it’s a possibility. However, (“I”) basically it’s — (“IT” X) I — I think that — the Spirit had told the family that first of all that someone from Paramount Pictures would be coming. (X) A movie would be made and they would become very rich.

J: Um-huh.

Q: Well I think (this meant) they were going to become very spiritually wealthy I think is what the message was because something very similar happened in the original Bell — Bell Witch case.

J: So they — they hoped there would be financial reward but would it be fair to say that they didn’t really expect financial reward?

Q: Well they — they — that’s all documented in — they — they did get a little money up front when they signed the contract.

J: Um-huh.

Q: There were eight people. (X) Spirit actually — I — I had the spirit message “AND THAT’S ALL.” So eight of them basically were to get the assets.

J: Um-huh.

Q: Of course, everything is free on the Internet. The whole book — for example, the Fortean Times (article) begins the paperback first edition. It is available at, you know, on websites like (X) Barnes and Noble and Amazon; however, no one can even find it because if you look up Testament you’ll get (X) a thousand different books so you really need (“TO”) to key in the catalog (I meant ISBN) number.

J: Um-huh. (X) Now — now let me get you back to the website here.

Q: Yeah.

J: Because we (“WE”) do the exper — or surfs in the introduction —

Q: So that’s — that’s the same basic format as — as the book. It’s in sequential order.

J: Um-huh.

Q: I don’t really have an index of interview participants. (“AT THE”) At the start of each tape side–I present each section as a tape side–transcript, it says–after the initial Oklahoma interviews–who the participants are for each tape side.

J: Um-huh. Um-huh.

Q: And I find — (X) it is a fairly popular website and I — because I do have a statistics page that tells me (from) how many countries each month people come and visit; and what people — what are the most popular parts of the — of the website.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And I must say it is pretty consistent. It’s — I had about 70,000 visits last year and from like (“OVER”) usually every month (X) there’s over 50 different countries (“REP”) represented of visitors.

J: Now there are listed on your website tapes both side one and two numbering at least over 50 separate tapes, correct?

Q: Right. And then in the New Testament section I — I’m sort of getting away from that and pres(ent) — presenting tape sides as just one tape because it’s — it’s less work for the reader to — to go from tape — you know, to click on the next tape side and what-have-you.

J: Right. Uh-huh. (“BUT THE”)

Q: In fact, the new book, New Testament, which is just available on the Internet, is even longer than the first book.

J: Um-huh. (X)

Q: But they’re — since they are question and answer interviews, they’re fairly easy to read and —

J: Yes, they do — I — I’ve had time to, you know, catch a few things here during the breaks and very readable. And I — and I really think I should urge our listeners to — to follow the path at the website. You’ve done a great job — you — you’ve done enormous detail. I mean no one can say you left out information and — and it’s just a fine, fine job you’ve done with this website here . . .


Q: Well I — I’m still worried that it’s — it’s — by the very nature of it, I want it to be documentary style but I — I don’t know. I — I would like to sort of boil down the story in more readable terms. I know there was a book by Jess Stern called A Prophet In His Own Country about Edgar Cayce that I thought was very readable.

J: Um-huh.

Q: But I don’t really foresee having the opportunity (X) to write such — such a book. At least at this time. I — I did invest my life savings in the book and website so —

J: Um-huh.

Q: — I do have a day job to make ends meet (“AND”) and what-have-you.

J: And are you all okay with that? Are you happy with all the decisions you’ve made?

Q: Oh sure.

J: Uh-huh.

Q: Sure, I’m — (X) I — I — I’m in a job that is acceptable to me at the moment.

J: Uh-huh. Now what about whatever you feel — do you feel you have a mission? In other words, you have kind of a — a job to do on this Earth with all this material?

Q: Well —

J: A calling?

Q: As I mentioned in that paragraph, I do — I do — having — after my experience, I do see how many people throughout history have been Christed ones. In fact, each of us really is a Christed one. It’s just that people don’t really understand. There’s just so much dogma out there.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And my book sort of shows how most of the dogma in religions are metaphor.

J: Um-huh. And so well what is your message of good news for us? That we are Christed ones? That we are Christ ourselves?

Q: Well —

J: “Thou art God” and a Michael Valentine Smith sort of thing?

Q: Well the word love also — the same letters in the word ‘love’ also go into the word ‘evolve.’

J: Um-huh. (“AND AS”)

Q: As I have evolved from this corporate publicist who participated in cover-ups about “Braveheart” and etc., etc., —

J: Um-huh.

Q: — can evolve to become a more spiritual person — and God could even put up with me and my foibles and quirks and — on a bad day you might say that people might misinterpret me as coming to — to judge the world instead of saving it. But on a good day (“I”) I definitely am (“A COMMU”) a communicator of the ma(ny) — the very Loving experience I’ve had. (X) Because if you really look at most of our experience day to day, we have so much kindness from other people and really we all — all are an iota (X) of Spirit just as every animal is and every insect. In fact, I know in — in that — that book that I found — that 47 about Edgar Cayce (“TH”) he did talk about the Oneness of Spirit or (“FOR”) — actually, he called it the Oneness of All Force.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And that pretty much defined it, basically saying that when you do something to another person it’s like doing it to God because we each are a manifestation of God. So let’s say if you murder another person, you’re murdering God.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And there is karma and reincarnation because there is ultimate forgiveness in the universe and we’re all evolving constantly. So I think my book illustrates in a day to day fashion how if Spirit can put up with someone like me — a very judgmental, self-occupied person —

J: Um-huh.

Q: — then we’re all in pretty good shape.

J: You know, we’re — we’re coming to the end of our time, Mark, but what I hope you’ll allow us to do here — and allow me especially — is to really digest the enormous amount of content you have in the website and revisit this with you —

Q: Oh sure.

J: — in the not-too-distant future.

Q: Fine.

J: That would be great. And I — and I urge our listeners also — check out the website. Just, you know, maybe you can’t read it all right now and we want you to pay attention to our radio program but you will discover that there is an enormous amount of information there that really is the data that is behind what Mark is talking about with us here.

Q: Yeah, it’s a documentary-style case study.

J: Yes, I find it very, you know, appealing in the — in the way you have presented it here and I’m — as I do get a chance to take a little more look each — each break we’re having, I’m finding it will appeal to all our listeners. I — I just know it will. You know, they’ll — they’ll like knowing this and then they’ll be ready next time.

Q: And they can Email me any questions that they might have too.

J: And you can —

Q: O(n) — on the homepage down at — below, it has my Email —

J: Okay.

Q: — address, where you can click on and send me an Email.

J: Well that’s great. Well — well thank you —

Q: Okay.

J: — for all this time tonight and, you know, happy new year to you.

Q: Yeah. Thank you for having me on.

J: Oh our pleasure absolutely and we’ll look forward to a next time when we’re much better educated. And — and we can really get into some questions I can’t even imagine here at the moment.

Q: Well yeah. I’ll have to tell you about my worms phenomena.

J: Well, you know, I’d also l(ike) — worms I don’t even know where you’re going with that one. (X “SINCE”)

Q: Well I just thought I would mention that because of the Mars news.

J: Worms. Mars. Insects. But I also would like to hear when we have a chance a little bit more about your Hollywood experience and how it has influenced your thinking here ‘cause several times you — you’ve mentioned things you know almost in passing about either the things that are wrong with Hollywood that we get. And then you just piqued my curiosity incredibly a moment ago when you said a coverup related to “Braveheart.” Could — could we as we let — (“BO[TH]”) before we let you go here tonight, could you just explain what you mean by that one?

Q: Well I think if anyone goes to any of the reference books regarding William Wallace, (“THE”) the real story is —

J: Yes.

Q: — such a far cry from the — the movie.

J: Uh-huh.

Q: And it was my job to present — to posi(tion) — position the film for the press and media. And no one ever thought twice about looking at it (“ED”) in any other way from — (“THAN”) than was — what was presented in the press kit so —

J: Uh-huh.

Q: Basically, they just bought the surface of the movie the way it was —

J: Uh-huh.

Q: — without checking the facts. And —

J: And yet the facts were readily available.

Q: Oh of course. (“IN”) Just about every library, I would think. That’s what I do. When I was assigned to work on the film is I went to the — the main library downtown and was horrified by what I read.

J: But your job was to really present —

Q: Well I thought —

J: — the film as a — of a terrific depiction of William Wallace.

Q: Exactly. Historically accurate —

J: And this — this bothered your conscience, I take it.

Q: Well not at the time. I — I mean we also had — we had a film about sui(cide) — teen suicide that we found out could influence people to commit — teenagers to commit suicide just by glamorizing suicide.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And the other executives did feel that this was a problem.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And it was my job (X) position the film in the press kit in such a way to absolve us all of any kind of culpability.

J: Um-huh.

Q: And I’ve come a long way since then, let’s just say. At the ti(me) —

J: Well we have a — a lot to talk about —

Q: Okay.

J: — in the future, Mark, but —

Q: Yeah, I’ve worked on some good movies and I can — I can explain little things like why the third “Godfather” movie got such horrendous reviews —

J: Um-huh.

Q: And meanwhile it did so well with the Academy.

J: Yeah. We’re going to follow up these things with you.

Q: Okay.

J: So thanks very much again.

Q: Alright.

J: And we wish you the happiest new year. And we’ll talk again to you soon.

Q: Yeah. And it will be interesting to see what happens on Mars.

J: We will all find out later tonight. And folks, Mark’s website: testament dot org. Check it out. Mark, thank you very much. We’ll talk to you again in the near future. Ladies and gentlemen, we’ll be back right around the bend here.

Q: (off air) Thank you, Jack.

( . . . )

Q: (speaking into tape recorder) Well Jack made some additional comments about me later in the show that I plan on recording on archive cassettes; however, (X) continuing from Tape #786, I wanted to mention that before I had my second kidney stone attack I was at the gym that morning and I had a feeling that something bad might happen when I saw this woman’s T-shirt which I’ve seen before but I just felt (X) the timing wasn’t so good. It was a T-shirt with a little pouty face saying “Whatever it is, I didn’t do it.”


J: This is Jack Landman and you are in “Cybercity.” And I know you have a lot of questions, probably even some doubts about Mark Russell Bell who was with us. Understandable of a wild story and seemingly one who interprets things as though they have a huge significance when, you know, from an outsider’s point of view it may be very mundane. But on the other hand you need to check his website out before you make any conclusions because of presentation — he does a great job of presenting this texturally. And by the fact that he does not edit. I mean clearly as you look at the transcripts of his tapes — unedited completely. I mean everything everyone said even if they said dopey things or, you know, in bad English, whatever, it’s there. And there’s more of a story there than meets the eye. (“AND”) And I bet if we stick with this with him another visit or two we — we may find that it’s much more worthwhile than I know some of you doubters are thinking right now. But check out the website (X) and see what you think. And — and if you think I’m wrong, just send me an Email and let me know. You know? You — you can straighten me out if you think that’s necessary. Now let’s get to the other big topic of our evening here — Mars, yessiree, and the coming landing. I mean we’re only a couple hours away now. I want to give you a — a — an alert there. We have made connections with Dr. Sky, Steve Cates, who is really often our expert on things that are being done at NASA or JPL. And, of course, he is an official ambassador for — for NASA but he will be joining us (X) live just before 10 p.m. And so he’ll be with us right up until the time the lander gets down. And he can give us an enormous amount of information about this. He happens to be — Kris just visited with him a little while ago — spending some of this evening with two of the young people that named the two missions — that named the — I guess the — the name Spirit, Kris? And the — what’s the other device’s name? Opportunity. Spirit and Opportunity . . . (later) . . . so T-bone Burnett coming up in either two or three weeks. I’ll have to wait til next weekend before I can give you the details (X) on that. So Seth Shostak, T-Bone Burnett — I mean it just — the hits keep coming, folks. We’re going to keep putting interesting, unusual and informed guests in front of you. Even if some of them are a little harder to understand why we have here and what their message is. I’m going to be quite honest with you. Such as Mark tonight. Hearing his story firsthand — I mean for the first time in a kind of a disjointed hop-around way, it didn’t give it the credibility that I think (X) will later sink in to you as we visit with him again. And as you check out the website. Now back to Mars, the great red planet which will be meeting our machines tonight. We don’t know what happened a week ago to the Beagle II. Remember the European Space Agency had a — a mission and it was to have landed on Christmas day. And it was never heard from again. In other words, it went down to the planet and could have crashed. The transmitter could be messed up. They’re still trying to raise a signal. They even think — the scientists think (“THAT”) once these two machines get on the planet that they may be able to help and find the Beagle. What’s that Kris? Kris was asking me if they’re landing near it and I don’t know the answer to that one. But fortunately we have Dr. Sky tonight. Try out that wireless microphone, Kris. Talk into it and let’s see how you sound.

K: Testing. Can you hear me?

J: We hear you faintly. Let’s see if we can get a little more volume from you.

K: How about — how about now?

J: That’s good.

K: Okay.

J: Yeah, pretty good.

K: Getting some interference there from the RF . . .

J: Yeah, RF — that RF. You know everyone says RF. It means radio frequency. What does that mean, you know? That’s what you’ve got to think about.

K: (small laugh)

J: Anyway, it’s a transmitter and a receiver is what we have going on here. Kris is using our “Cybercity” special wireless microphone and these wireless microphones can be either the bane or the joy. Either way and tonight the — the — the jury’s still out. However, we are having quirky technical problems. I hope they’re not affecting you out there in radioland. I know I did hear from a couple of you during the course of our previous interview. You pointed out that we did lose picture for a bit and yes we did. We lost picture, we lost Email. It did make me wonder about his poltergeist a little bit so, anyway, back to Mars again — yes, Kris?

K: Oh I was just going to say I — I told you during the break. You can blame me for the loss of the video there because as I was moving the camera around I accidentally unplugged one of the cables.

J: A mundane explanation.

K: However, I — I don’t know what caused the — the problem that made you have to restart the whole computer before it would take.

J: It just seemed so weird.

K: Maybe that was, in fact, Michael.

J: Michael — no, no, Michael’s a benevolent and loving ghost —

K: Okay.

J: — who does positive things.

K: That’s true. Well maybe it was one of the evil ghosts.

J: Ghost isn’t the right word. You know what I found interesting, Kris, (“YEAH”) for whatever reason I selected that excerpt I read from Stranger In A Strange Land and it seemed to me that Mark Russell Bell’s message was very similar to Valentine Michael Smith’s.

K: Yeah, I was thinking that right when you — you even used the quote “Thou art God” when you . . .

J: Yes, when . . .

K: . . . summarize it.

J: . . . Yeah.

K: Yeah, I was thinking that too.

J: Yeah, strange, huh? But we won’t read too much into that.

K: (small laugh)

J: Okay, so getting back to Mars and all there is to think about, about what’s going on there . . .